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13 May 2012 @ 05:19 pm
3.22 - 'The Departed' (The Vampire Diaries)  
Alright, here I am with the episode write-up for the season 03 finale. I have some issues, but I've come to a very good place overall. You may be wondering why and how... if so, step inside for a long read. :) (There are references to Julie Plec's vague outlines for season 04.)

I'd be lying if I said that I wasn't upset that we're not going to get Human!Elena and Damon. However, I've been doing a LOT of thinking about everything over the last few days, and I've been reminded of what I wrote about "The Murder of One."

Expectations are a bitch. It's really as simple as that. Even without the episode preview that featured the close moment between Damon and Elena, and the still of Elena seemingly rescuing Damon -- which with lighting and low video quality looked like they could be from two different scenes, I still had an expectation that the gang, or at least Stefan, Elena and Alaric, would rescue Damon. I hoped that it would be a reverse of the Stefan rescue in "Let the Right One In," which led me to expect much more than what we got. I had this expectation that the rescue would occupy enough of the episode because whenever anyone else in the gang is kidnapped and/or tortured (Stefan, Caroline, Elena) and others are aware of it, there is a high level of urgency and much discussion and airtime devoted to rescuing said person who's been kidnapped. But, yeah, expectations are a bitch, especially when they don't really track with the reality of the show.

The same thing happened here, but instead of an expectation about one episode, it was an expectation that was nurtured over the course of the entire season. And I held onto this expectation even when there were definite signs that I was missing the bigger picture (Elena still loving Stefan despite everything) because *I* didn't want her to love Stefan. I was ignoring my own oft-repeated mantra that you don't choose who you love. Elena loves Damon even though she doesn't want to, because when the heart makes its choice, you have no say in the matter. The same applies to Stefan and Elena, but because I don't ship them, and I don't like them, I didn't, couldn't see that. I was analyzing the Damon/Elena aspects of the story, and mostly glossing over any positive Stefan/Elena aspects because I didn't want to even imagine any version of a positive outcome for them.

Now I feel like I've gone through the five stages of grief, and I reached acceptance yesterday afternoon, and once I got there, I started looking at the entire season through the intended lens, instead of what my expectation led me to (in retrospect, delusionally believe, i.e., that Elena would fall in love with Damon, get over Stefan and be ready to move on only with Damon, while Stefan found love elsewhere). I went into the season EXPECTING this to be THE season for Damon and Elena. I realize now that such wasn't the intention; it was about bringing Damon and Elena closer to even out the playing field between the brothers. Because of the development of the Elena and Damon relationship, she is now conflicted, but right now, she's still at the point in her life where she would choose Stefan.

At the end of season 02, it wasn't even a question of a choice. Yes, she cared about Damon, and she was sad about losing him, but it was about friendship in her mind. However, now it's about more, and she knows this. She's accepted that something between them exists that she wasn't willing to see, acknowledge and accept in season 02. Now it's about something much more than friendship, and now there is a choice to be made. A choice that would have been inconceivable to her six months ago, because it was Stefan, always Stefan, Damon wasn't even in the game.

Elena told Damon that it would always be Stefan at the beginning of season 02. Damon repeated those words back to her on his deathbed at the end of season 02, and she didn't, couldn't deny it. However, at the end of season 03, when Damon repeated those words again, she told him that she didn't know about always, only what she was feeling in that moment right now. That's a HUGE difference in attitude, and WHY we had the Damon/Elena growth in season 03. In "The Return," it was "I care about you, but I love Stefan, it will always be Stefan." Here, yes, she told him again that she cared about him, but she loved Stefan and he said "always, Stefan" and she DENIED that certainty. Elena couldn't say that always now, because she realizes now that she doesn't know that it will always be Stefan, she just knows that right now it is. This ties back to "Our Town" when Elena told Damon that what was happening between them wasn't right, and he said it was right, just not "right now."

So he knew then that it wasn't right now. And Elena is accepting that. It's not that the something between them isn't there; it's not that it's not right ... they are just not right now. "Right now" it's Stefan ... but not always. (Yes, yes, there would be nothing beyond the right now due to the circumstances, but Elena's emotional state -- who do I need to see before they are gone from my life forever? -- is what is at play here. And right now, it's Stefan.) Yes, even with Damon being gone from her life forever. Because Stefan's life was on the line too. And she loves him, and they haven't been together *together* in six months. So yes, she's going to choose to be with Stefan in that moment ... because, right now, she knows that she loves him.

To concentrate only on how much she does care about Damon, and derive from that anger and disappointment that she didn't choose in that moment then to go to him ignores the Stefan-side of the equation. Whether we like it or not, she DOES love Stefan. And HE was going to be gone from her life forever too. Stefan is someone that saved her soul, and helped her to live again. He's someone that she had completely given herself to, and then lost for six months, and just when maybe they were going to have a chance to get back to where they were ... he's going to die. She's never going to see him again. So it makes perfect sense that she chooses THAT someone over the one that she really does care deeply for, but is in loads of confusion about, and someone that was just a 'what if?' possibility. Having the choice of seeing the certainty or the possibility before both die ... anyone in that position is GOING to choose the certainty.

With all that said, it must also be mentioned that Elena was in full denial-girl mode in another aspect. She wasn't allowing herself to accept the reality that she wouldn't ever see Damon again. That is what she said in the phone call; she said that she would see him soon. Even though the whole point of this was that, no, she wouldn't see him ... or Stefan again. She was in denial about that reality because it hurt too much. And I can't blame her, or hate on her for that.

As for the whole aspect of the phone call in general, I wouldn't want her first declaration of love to Damon to be (a) over the phone (!) and (b) while she still very much loves Stefan. Elena telling Damon what she did was very true to them in that they were both honest with one another. Except for a very, very few instances, these two have a foundation of honesty in their relationship that is refreshing and frankly awesome. I genuinely feel that Elena saying what she did (and how) to Damon, aside from being honest, showed how much she cared for him.

Unless she wanted to lie -- which again that's not them -- there was no way to let Damon know how much she cared other than how she did. Had she not mentioned her love for Stefan, it would have been a declaration of love leading to ... okay, then why wasn't she going to him? There needed to be an honest reason as to why she wasn't going to him in his final moments. And she gave him that honesty. The fact that she was crying, that she was trying so hard to make him understand how much she did care, how hard this was for her showed just how much she cared, and that this wasn't an easy choice for her. (A choice that wouldn't have even been in play six months ago!) Yes, Stefan was her choice, but it was a hard one to make.

Furthermore, for me, had she said I love you, did Elena actually, fully realize and accept that she loved Damon, that would have been worse because it would have shown that even though she did love him, even though she KNEW that she loved him ... it STILL wasn't enough. She still loved Stefan more. However, her not realizing it, and not getting truly what she feels shows that she isn't there yet. Meaning that there is still hope that love -- real, true, forever, always love -- is coming for them, and that it will be stronger than what she feels for Stefan right now.

I do think that we would have seen her take the risk of exploring something with Damon if there had been time and death wasn't imminent. Looking at the first point, Stefan kissed Elena goodbye as he did because he really did appear as if he believed that she wasn't going to choose him, and the way Elena called his name to speak to him before he did so, it's certainly believable that she did intend to tell him that she was going to take a chance with Damon. And then the situation changed. Death was imminent. In addtion, she had just lost her anchor in Alaric which was one of the bigger selling points for Stefan. I look at it this way ... she lost her anchors (her parents) and Stefan was the one who pulled her out of the depths, literally and figuratively. She knows that he can do that for her again. It's a safe, secure place. Damon is a risk, a terrifying risk and after losing yet someone else she loves, she needed the cocoon of safety that she knows Stefan can provide. Timing is everything. And right now, timing was just not on Damon's side. Now it can be and he and Elena have a helluva long time to get to their right now... which will be always for them.

Does it hurt so from a Damon/Elena fangirl point of view that there was the very real possibility that there would be no always, but only right now? Yes, but that goes back to the honesty issue. I would prefer, and Damon would prefer that Elena be honest with him. And since that's one of the things I love about them, I can't regret that. And even with that painful honesty, it was obvious to Damon that it *was* painful for her. Compare that to, again "The Return," where he asked Katherine to be honest with him about her feelings. She was cruel about it, denying any care for him at all. Here, Elena was honest, but it was clear that her heart was breaking. And Damon knew that. He knew that despite everything, despite his past, he was worthy of her tears because she did care at least that much at this point.

One of the things that Julie Plec said in the post-finale interviews is that when they wrote "The Last Day" in season 02, they knew that it would be the last romantic Stefan/Elena episode for about a year, and so this episode was the romantic payoff for that long, hard in-between where they were separated and awful things happened. And to that I say, really? That was the pay-off? An Elena who chose Stefan almost by default? An Elena who found it heartbreakingly difficult to choose him over his brother? An Elena who, when talking to Matt about her feelings for him, spoke about the perception of love and what it should be and how that related to Stefan as opposed to Stefan himself alone, paired with saying that when she's with Damon, he consumes her? An Elena who barely reacted to the first kiss they've shared in six months? That was the emotional payoff? If that were Damon and Elena and that was my payoff, I would not be a happy camper. At all.

I've been going over the entire season in my brain from the point of view that they meant to get to Stefan/Elena at the end, and taking the Damon/Elena expectation out of it, it *does* make sense ... and yet still shows *great* promise for Damon/Elena because despite the fact that Elena never stopped loving Stefan, Damon still got under her skin and she found herself so incredibly drawn to him. Even with her loving Stefan, and determined to not feel for Damon, every season, Damon has, indeed, made major inroads into her heart. :)

Then there was that Damon/Elena flashback that showed us that Stefan was not the first one to meet her. Yes, Elena told Damon that if she'd met him first things might have been different merely to soften the blow, however, the fact that viewers were given that reality that she did meet him first means something. Because she will remember that, not so much that, yes, she met him first, but what he said when they met, how well he knew her and connected to her right away, how he knew she wasn't Katherine so quickly. That stuff will matter. And it also showed something that we know for sure, but Elena didn't, or wouldn't remember in terms of the kind of guy Damon was capable of being even when they first met. We saw as early as episode three ("Friday Night Bites"), that softer, sweeter side of Damon that Elena was able to bring out. She'll fully be aware of that now.

And add to that, DAMON got the emotional fall-out of EVERYTHING. We didn't get to see Stefan learning that he was Elena's choice, and any possible happiness or joy that would have entailed (according to Plec, Stefan didn't know he was Elena's choice, but finding out after she's turned will be incredibly bittersweet; his reunion will not be with the human girl he loves). Instead we saw Elena's tears and heartbreak over letting Damon know that she wasn't choosing to be with him right now. We didn't see Stefan find out that Elena had died, his heartbreak and devastation over that ... nope, that was off-screen when he went back to get her after saving Matt. Instead we saw Damon realize that she was dead, saw his devastation on display. We didn't see Stefan find out that Elena would be a vampire; he already knew at the end, his disclosure had happened off-screen. Instead we saw Damon find out that she would turn. It was all about Damon's reaction to what was happening to Elena, viewers being put in Damon and Elena's emotional shoes about what was happening with the other.

So even though Elena chose Stefan right now, it's telling that the season wasn't about Stefan and Elena finding their way back to each other. And the only thing that makes sense to me is that it's because it's not about Stefan and Elena's love story; they are a bump on the eventual road to Damon and Elena. Honestly, that's how I do see it even looking through the season knowing that Elena would reunite with Stefan in the end. Had this season been about Stefan and Elena finding their way back to each other, that would have made it their love story. But it's not. We never saw them recover from what happened while she was human, and we won't fully see that now because life (or rather, death) interrupted.

Julie Plec has said specifically that Stefan and Elena won't have the same relationship, all peaches and cream, etc. Stefan won't be comfortable with Elena, the vampire. That gives me great hope that we are going to get the natural dissolution of their relationship. Had she chosen Damon at the end of this season, the triangle would have continued with her still having moments, yearning for Stefan, etc. because they weren't over. Stefan and Elena have to be over before she chooses Damon or a part of Damon will always feel like the second choice.

I see this season as proof that what she feels for Damon is long-term, always, but Elena just isn't ready for that kind of love. The fact that she maintained loving Stefan through the whole season, and DID continually have those moments with him, and the fact that she DIDN'T want to fall for Damon or feel anything ... yet, she still did is incredibly telling. Her pull to Damon is that strong that she kept losing her battle to NOT feel for him. Over and over and over again. Despite loving Stefan ... she couldn't keep herself from falling for Damon. She's just not ready to deal with that. And I think that the flashbacks with Elena talking to her mom about Matt made that clear.

Originally, I was frustrated because it felt like they were equating her not loving Matt with not loving Damon. However, thinking about it more, I feel that it was about explaining not only her certainty in choosing Stefan now, but also her confusion about what she feels for Damon. Elena knows absolutely what she has with Stefan, and they never came to a natural conclusion. The parallel wasn't that she didn't know that she didn't love Matt (thus paralleling that she knows that she doesn't love Damon). The parallel was that she doesn't know what love is. Yes, her mom told her that she knew she didn't love Matt, because deep down Elena did know that she didn't feel for him as he did for her, but she just wasn't ready to deal with the repercussions of accepting that knowledge. Consider the fact that Elena didn't break up with Matt UNTIL after her parents died. Yeah, yeah, it happened that night, but the point is that it took a MAJOR event to make her sit up and figure out what she didn't know, and deal with the repercussions.

I think that the same thing will happen now. She's going to have to sit up and figure out what this thing she feels for Damon is. She figured out and accepted that she didn't love Matt, and was ready to deal with the repercussions. She didn't love him, but because she figured that she was supposed to, instead of realizing that it wasn't love, she was confused ... she didn't know if she just didn't understand what love was, not that she didn't love him. With Stefan she knows that it is love, she now has a definition. However with Damon, what she feels is different than it is with Stefan, so how can it be love? But it's something ... she just doesn't know what it is. But she does -- thus the parallel -- she's just not ready to realize and accept what she knows deep down because she's not ready to deal with the repercussions. That's the parallel I see. (And I know that paragraph was a confusing mess, but I can't figure out how to word it any more clearly, I'm sorry.)

I mean, of course, she DOES love Damon; she just doesn't understand, doesn't realize that what she feels for Damon IS love because it's so different from what she has ever believed that love is. What she feels for Damon confuses the hell out of her because it doesn't fit her neat definition. Right now, she can't handle Damon. Frankly, she's just not ready to handle Damon. I think now that that was the point of "Heart of Darkness” and what happened between them. Alas, that's where one of the writing fails of the latter half of this season came in. We needed to know that specifically.

I think had we seen the conversation with Caroline where Elena told her about happened in Denver, it would have helped tremendously to explain where Elena was coming from. That would have been a case of the viewers needing to be told something. Her telling Caroline that what happened freaked her out, that it was all too much, too overwhelming ... all of that would have made what happened in 3.22 make much more sense. We should have heard Elena talk about being consumed, her reaction to him, what she feels for him terrifying her, and that would have made sense as to why she chose the route of safety, the road she's comfortable with considering everything that was happening. But we didn't get that.

Yeah, definitely one of the definite fails in the writing and execution of the second half of the season. Don't get me wrong, there were some great episodes in that second half, but overall, especially in the last three episodes, there was some major disconnect and story not shown or told that needed to happen. The sudden defined need for Elena to make a choice was, to put it frankly, stupidly, unnecessarily and badly done. Period. I already ranted about that after last week's episode. It felt more natural in this one, but it was still a bit too much tell, and not in a good way. And, of course, the fact that Stefan has not, and likely will not ever suffer ANY FREAKING CONSEQUENCES for the things he did is beyond frustrating. Unless ... it is coming.

Yes, I've now decided to once more trust the writers. Considering that we had Rose say that Damon challenges Elena, and had Matt say that Stefan should challenge Elena, I'm at the point now where I believe that we will get there about Stefan and all facets relating to his special brand of issue-town. We'll get actual canon commentary that it's not right how Stefan so passively responds to everything-Elena (while going balls-to-the-wall for everything Damon-related). Realization will come that he needs to strike a balance that he's so far off from. This show is clearly not writing an episode by episode or season by season tale; they are doing the whole six years journey. And I've been pleased so much overall with so much, that I'm going to take a deep breath and trust that we will get there by the end of the six years because there have been too many lines, too many moments, too many things that point to the fact that she is making mistakes, Stefan is making mistakes. It's just going to be a journey that lasts longer than one season.

As for the Stefan/Elena and their issues angle, well, I've mostly come to terms with Elena not having an issue with what happened on Wickery Bridge -- although, if discussion of it comes up next season, I will NOT complain. I'm also convinced that, until told otherwise, the others don't know of all the horrible things that Stefan did. And, of course, Jeremy and Bonnie really don't appear to like him at all anymore. That's good and fair. However, Elena forgiving him and not giving him grief over what he did to her on Wickery Bridge is a personal decision, and fits with Elena's character in that she is capable of ridiculous amounts of compassion and forgiveness. But again, that's personal. What he did to Andie ... that is what sticks in my craw and always will. He cruelly, horribly killed her, and then made his reasoning behind it completely pointless by calling Elena. Grrr. I will never not be pissed about that. *sigh* So, while I do think that Stefan-realization is going to come eventually, I believe there are things that he did that he won't ever be held accountable for that he should. (ANDIE!)

This brings me to where I am at now with the show. I still love it. I still think it's the best show on television for my viewing and analytical pleasure. However, I'm no longer going to not ding them on fails, or automatically take on faith that they are heading somewhere. I'll wait it out and wait for them to prove themselves, because so much sloppy, disconnected writing in the second half has fractured my easy belief in the writing. But, like Fox Mulder, I still want to believe. Thus all of these ... words!

I *think* what happened is that Kevin Williamson was around helping to lay out the first half, not as much as he had in seasons past, but enough that his guiding hand was there because he only had The Secret Circle to contend with as well. However, he then began work on his Pilot for Fox, and I wonder if with his concentration on that and The Secret Circle, he left The Vampire Diaries in the hands of Julie Plec and the producers. Hopefully, with The Secret Circle canceled, he will be able to devote time to TVD -- at least as much as he did in the first half of season 03. (Which delivered some of my absolute favorite episodes.)

I said at the top that I'm upset that we won't get human!Elena and Damon, but I think now that it was all intended as such by the writers. As a human girl, Elena would always have chosen Stefan. And due to the structure of the show (three seasons barely equaling a year and a half), unless they did extreme time jumps, we would never have gotten to an older, more mature Elena without sacrificing the journey of Elena growing up and maturing into her love for Damon. However, as a vampire, she'll choose Damon, partially because Damon loves her, fully, completely without condition. Which based on comments in Plec's interviews about season 04 (i.e., Stefan will have issues with Elena being a vampire), means that Stefan's love *would* be conditional (connected, in part, to her humanity), whereas Damon loves her no matter what/who she is.

I'm not happy that we won't have human Elena with Damon, but that is disappointment based on my expectation of what I wanted, and nothing that was ever implicitly or even subtly implied was owed to us as part of the ongoing story. And something occurred to me: If they do decide to go the route of Elena somehow becoming human again at some point (after all, the door was opened that it's possible with Esther's plan to turn her vampire children human in order to kill them), I want Elena as a vampire to last until season 05 or even early season 06. And maybe by the time that happens, she'll be with Damon. Then having lived as both human and vampire, she'll make that choice -- having lived both possibilities -- that she wants to be become a vampire to be with Damon throughout eternity. Could happen. And that way, we'd kinda get our cake and eat it too. It could happen, totally.

Beyond that hopeful theory for the later seasons, I don't know obviously, but I'm fairly optimistic where we're heading for season 04. Do I think that it will be awful for Stefan/Elena until the fracture breaks them up? Of course not. I do think we'll have to sit through more of the Stefan/Elena twu-wuv crap, however, if they go the direction I expect I can grit my teeth and bear it because it will be the mirror to what Damon/Elena got in the first half of season 03, and will lead to the final two seasons featuring Damon and Elena. This post by loveepiclove makes an excellent case for this viewpoint. Taking into account what we know about these characters, it reasons that there will be issues if Stefan only planned on loving her for the comparatively few years he could while she was human because that touched upon what *he* wanted, while Damon loves her for eternity for who she is completely.

Plec has already outlined the bare bones of that in talking about the fourth season. Yes, Stefan/Elena will be together, but they will have problems. Her vampirism, his dealing with it, but as well, there will be the complication of Elena's feelings for Damon. That are there, and real. What I'm thinking is possibly going to happen -- which would give me my much-longed for balance -- is that we'll have Stefan and Elena together in the first half of the season.* This would be similar to Damon and Elena getting so much together-time in the first half of season 03. And then in the second half, like Damon and Elena were strained and apart, we'll get that with Stefan and Elena. This will then lead to Elena and Stefan fracturing based on their lack of working longevity (as opposed to external influences), with Elena choosing Damon at the end of season 04 -- leaving the two final seasons for the exploration of the Damon/Elena relationship. So that's two full seasons of Stefan and Elena. Two full seasons of equalizing things between them. The last two seasons being Damon and Elena. Fair balance that ends with Damon/Elena as endgame. :)

* I did want to point out that Plec said that they would be together for a little while. Before season 03, she said that Stefan would be away from Mystic Falls for a while ... that amounted to four episodes. I'm not saying that's all it will be with Stefan and Elena together, I'm just saying that "a little while" does not necessarily translate into the entire season.

I think a good sign that we are heading there could be in the premiere. I'm thinking of "The Birthday," and how there were positive Stefan/Elena scenes which DID highlight Elena's loyalty and love to Stefan. I saw that upon my first viewing of the episode, but was pissed about it and instead then focused on the Damon/Elena aspects only after a rewatch because I had delusionally convinced myself that Stefan and Elena just HAD to be over this season. I'm hopeful that we will see the opposite in 4.01, highlighting aspects of Elena's feelings for Damon even amidst some good Stefan/Elena stuff. The end of season premiere was Stefan/Elena-based (their phone call). We'll see where the end of 4.01 is based.... Hopefully, it will be more Damon/Elena based, and that could be telling indeed that we are heading to Elena finally not only loving Damon, but accepting that love.

I know that there is frustration that if all Damon did for her in season 03 specifically wasn't enough to make her love him, how will she ever? And to that I go back to my old standby that she *does* love him; she just genuinely does not know that she does. She doesn't understand that she does love him because she doesn't realize that what she feels for Damon IS love because it's so different from her current definition: Safe, secure, makes you happy. Sure, Damon makes her feel safe and secure, and he's made her happy, made her smile even amidst the crazy. However, he also consumes her, their relationship is filled with passion, fighting, disagreements, frustration, anger, etc. and those are all things that Elena doesn't associate with being in love. I kept saying that I honestly believed Elena meant it when she said "I don't know" with regards to her feelings for Damon. It confuses the hell out of her because it doesn't fit her neat definition of love. She just doesn't know, and she is young; she's just a few months past eighteen and hasn't fully matured into the woman she needs to be to be with Damon.

Throughout the second half of this season, I kept going back to the idea that we had Damon's journey in season 02, and I was expecting Elena's journey to have the same trajectory of one season, but there are a few key differences between Damon and Elena that explain why her journey would take longer for such a dramatic shift. Damon was the bad guy, he needed to drastically shift to deserve Elena, and so it needed to happen on a faster scale. Also, Damon is not the main character. Elena is, and so we naturally we'll see all the speed bumps, back and forth in greater exploration with her than we would with a lead supporting character. And, of course, Elena is just barely an adult, so she still has that process to go through a bit more of, Damon was 25 or so when he was turned. The good thing is that we have seen growth -- as I mentioned above. No, she's not there yet, but I do believe she will get there.

It will just be as a vampire that she gets there. Which, frankly, no, I'm not all that thrilled about it. I didn't want Elena to become a vampire against her will. I wanted Elena to turn because it was her choice, her choice to be with Damon for eternity. I hate that such was taken away from us. However, that is upset based on my expectation and desire, not on the story that they are telling. I've mostly thoroughly enjoyed the story that has been told the first three seasons, so I'm willing to continue that journey and believe that I certainly am capable of enjoying the story that they plan on telling, possibly even more than what I had imagined. (And there's always my hopeful theory above!)

And now onto other aspects of the episode, and I'm going for random thoughts now. :)

- Damon is awesome. My single favorite part of the episode was his "No, no, no, no, no..." over the speaker phone during the group pow-wow. Every moment with him was awesome, good, heartbreaking, fantastic and damn funny. In other words, typical Damon. :D

- I wish that we had seen more of the reality of Ric's claim that his friendship with Damon is what made it so hard to get to his "true" self. However, it was a nice bit given there, and a sign to Damon that he was appreciated and his being Ric's friend gave them that much more time to get all their ducks in a row. And, oh my, Damon realizing that Alaric was dying, double-horrific for him, watching his friend die (a second time really), and knowing that it meant that Elena was dead as well was just so beautifully, devastatingly handled by Ian Somerhalder.

- What wasn't beautiful or devastating in any good way was the lack of emotional connection between Stefan and Damon. They believe they are going to die, gone for good and when they talk on the phone they have barely any words to say about each other, their love, their relationship? Instead it's just all about Elena? Really? Yeah, not loving that.

- I also didn't love Tyler saying that Stefan and Damon only care about themselves and not him and Caroline. Hello?! Damon literally put his life on the line (and would have died had an unexpected cure not been found) to save Tyler and Caroline's lives last season. And Stefan and Damon both put themselves on the line to save Caroline after Tyler's were-buddies tortured her. Uh huh!

- Speaking of Tyler and Caroline... uhm, where the heck is this great love for Tyler from Caroline's point of view coming from? She treated him like a friend with benefits before he left, and then was jealous over Matt while Tyler was gone, and found herself intrigued by Klaus. Sure, she cares about him, but this great AAAHHH!love between them from her end felt like it came out of nowhere for me and was on display to amp up the dramatic tension. Not impressed.

- Oh Klaus! Taking advantage of being in Tyler's body to get some macking in on Caroline. Tsk, tsk. I don't really care all that much about this surprise. I'm glad that we didn't see Klaus' body fully burn and supposedly he won't be in Tyler's body for very long. Good. I'm happy about that because, frankly, I don't think that Michael Trevino is up to playing Klaus. And I want Joseph Morgan back ASAP!

- You know all know that I love me some Elijah, but why the hell was he there? He brought ABSOLUTELY nothing to the episode. That was complete and utter fanservice. Seeing him and Rebekah connect for a bit and hug was sweet, though. Yeah.

- Not enough Rebekah. THERE IS NEVER ENOUGH REBEKAH! (Except in “Ordinary People” which featured Rebekah more than anyone else.) And I think she'll probably be a full cast member next season (yay!!!), and if so, I'd prefer if they developed some sort of prickly association between her and Damon and not just make them fuck-buddies. Firstly, I don't want that for either character, both deserve better. Secondly, REBEKAH AND MATT!!! WAAAHHH! Finally, Claire Holt and Ian Somerhalder are on the lower-radiation of the spectrum of people on the planet (read: every single one of them) that Somerhalder has chemistry with.

- I don't want Damon sexing up Meredith either, because I'd like them to genuinely become friends. Period. No sex. Just friends. And, yeah, I want Meredith to stick around because I do genuinely like her. There's just a sweetness about Torrey Devitto's performance that I enjoy.

- Bonnie is awesome. Full-stop. Period. With that said, I'm not getting all the vibes of Bonnie going evil that others have. I didn't get that from what she did in this episode. I saw her doing what just about every other character has done, making a really hard, pretty much wrong choice to save the people she loves. Ooh, and I do like that she's decided she won't be the witches' plaything anymore. You go, Bonnie!

- Also, I really, really hope that we continue to see this kind of interaction between Bonnie and Damon because their prickly brand of near-friendship filled with respect is kinda totally awesome. Now, I really don't want them to ever sleep together though because that would be so wholly and completely out of character for Bonnie. IN EVERY WAY POSSIBLE! Yes, Kat Graham and Somerhalder have chemistry. (After all, she is a person on the planet.) However, anything romantic or sexual ever happening between them just does not jibe with her character, and would cause a slew of issues and problems that are so not needed. Plus, it would destroy where there relationship is at now. Which is perfect as is, in my opinion.

- Also perfect? Pretty much every moment with Matt and Jeremy, together and separately. Man, I just love these two both so much now. Love, love, love them! I love that it sure seems like if Jeremy had to pick a team, he'd go with Damon. He may have issues with him, but he does actively appear to kinda rather not like Stefan at all. And, yay, yay, Jeremy called Damon about Elena, not Stefan. Yeah, yeah, he knew that Damon and Stefan were together... BUT, it was Damon's number he dialed, not Stefan's. I will take great pleasure from that, thank you very much.

As for Matt, I loved how he continues to be such a great friend to Elena despite their past. Oh, and how he seems to be way more Team!Damon than he is Team!Stefan, which makes sense on a few levels. Stefan is the guy that Elena hooked up with after she broke up with Matt, that sting will likely always be there. Also, Damon saved his life when Tyler was going to attack him and Caroline, and stopped Kol from doing anything beyond breaking his hand. And I loved that Matt had the same point of view that Damon has about Stefan's way of "respecting" Elena's decisions... which generally lead to her almost dying. Or, you know, actually dying! The fact that such a point was brought up gives me a wee bit of hope (but certainly nothing I'm sure of) that maybe, just maybe, Stefan's way of putting Elena's positive perception of him over discussing and disagreeing with her is not 100% kosher.

- Speaking of Elena and her decision-making skills... uhm, why was it only HER decision this time whether to trust Elijah? This wasn't about Elena particularly or the whole doppelganger aspect coming into play. This was a decision that should have been made by exactly four people involved in this ragtag group that comprises The Worst Planning Committee on the Planet -- Stefan, Damon, Caroline and Tyler. You know, the people who would DIE with their bloodline-sire going up in flames. Not the cute eighteen-year old that makes THE worst decisions ever generally.

- Lastly, the flashbacks. Sadly, I feel like Jenna was wasted, and I felt zero connection between Elena and her parents. Ah well. I did like the smiling Elena waking up to a song from a few year's back, and the flashback with her, Matt and Bonnie. It gave a quick, show-not-tell glimpse into their dynamic. That was well-done. And I did love the Damon/Elena flashback for showing that she did meet him first, there was a connection from the get-go, she was charmed and intrigued by him automatically, and he quickly realized that she wasn't Katherine and still saw something special in her.

The one flashback that didn't work frustrated me because it was so beautifully filmed and acted with lovely music. Alas, there was so much stupidity on display that I couldn't appreciate those aspects of the scene. What stupidity may you ask? Well...

1. Did Rebekah just stand there on the hopeful off-chance that Elena would come driving that way? How the hell did she know that Elena was coming? Only Matt and Jeremy knew of the 'take Elena out of Mystic Falls' plan.

I take this complaint back; I'd missed it, but Elijah told her that Elena called him and told him she was coming back to town.

2. Stefan is a vampire, how come he couldn't carry both from the water? Sure, he's probably not fast underwater as he is on land, but he still has the strength.

3. Okay, fine, he couldn't carry both, then why didn't he at least rip Elena's seatbelt off? She was conscious, she could have tried to swim on her own if he had done so.

4. The fact that I believe we're supposed to think that what Stefan did in respecting Elena's wish to save Matt and not herself was heroic and romantic. Yeah, uhm, nope. You save the person you love, not their friend, even if they'll be pissed at you. Once again, Stefan put wanting Elena to have a positive perception of him over wanting Elena alive. For reals. Not romantic. Not heroic. No.

Phew! And that's it for the season. And, yes, I'm back to being positive and optimistic again despite most of my earlier, ranting posts since the finale. I've always told myself that if it can make sense-character wise to me, I'll go along for the ride. Because I was blinded by MY expectations, I couldn't see where it did make sense. After going through the five stages of grief, and having moved onto acceptance, I do now. And everything that Julie Plec has said about season 04 actually has me feeling very positive now.

So, that's my current take. I know that many won't agree, and are still upset, but I really do feel good about it all again. There are issues still (my fear that the show doesn't get that Saint Stefan isn't actually a saint), but overall, I'm pleased in retrospect and I look forward to the rest of the journey.
 
 
 
Bogwitch: TVD - Damon Won't Tellbogwitch on May 13th, 2012 11:01 pm (UTC)
Wow, that was long!

I am glad you have come to a better place now though, as I enjoyed the episode, I kept my head under the parapet.

I am sticking to everything I said before about this being such a positive DE episode, despite the pain (which was just a bonus for me! I like Damon miserable).

>>Stefan is a vampire, how come he couldn't carry both from the water?

We know the answer to that.
Arabian: Stefan02arabian on May 13th, 2012 11:06 pm (UTC)
as I enjoyed the episode, I kept my head under the parapet.

Aww, you're sweet! But by all means, next time try and make me feel better about the episode. I hate not loving my precious, precious show!

this being such a positive DE episode, despite the pain

It really, really actually was.

We know the answer to that.

Because he's Stefan?
(no subject) - bogwitch on May 13th, 2012 11:11 pm (UTC) (Expand)
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vanimyvanimy on May 13th, 2012 11:04 pm (UTC)
PART ONE

First, awesome post is awesome. *puts in memories* And congrats to you for trying to be as unbiased as possible and look back on your own entries to analize your way of thinking.

I'd be lying if I said that I wasn't upset that we're not going to get Human!Elena and Damon.

Yeah, the loss of Human!Elena hit me hard. I have started to accept it though.

Another aspect I liked about the 'I'll see you soon' line other than the fact Elena couldn't face the prospect of losing them right then was the fact Elena took for granted she'd still see Damon again, that he'd still be part of her life even after she didn't choose him, even when she supposedly let him go.

You make a good point about the first ILY not being on the phone. I want it to be done properly.

One of the things that Julie Plec said in the post-finale interviews is that when they wrote "The Last Day" in season 02, they knew that it would be the last romantic Stefan/Elena episode for about a year, and so this episode was the romantic payoff for that long, hard in-between where they were separated and awful things happened. And to that I say, really? That was the pay-off? An Elena who chose Stefan almost by default. An Elena who found it heartbreakingly difficult to choose him over his brother. An Elena who, when talking to Matt about her feelings for him, spoke about the perception of love and what it should be and how that related to Stefan as opposed to Stefan himself alone, paired with saying that when she's with Damon, he consumes her. An Elena who barely reacted to the first kiss they've shared in six months. That was the emotional payoff? If that were Damon and Elena and that was my payoff, I would not be a happy camper. At all.

This is a really really good point.

The reasoning behind choosing Stefan wasn't 'I love him so much, Damon, he's the one for me' or something, it was 'I love him and he came at a moment when I needed someone badly.' Which is definitely not the same thing. Also that kiss felt a little like a goobye kiss, there's no comparison with the Damon/Elena kisses. These are two people who haven't kissed in months (a year? I have no idea what the timeline is lol) and may be all in danger. There's no urgency, no passion in that maybe last kiss.

Then there was that Damon/Elena flashback that retconned Stefan being the first one to meet her. Yes, Elena told Damon that if she'd met him first things might have been different merely to soften the blow, however, the fact that viewers were given that reality that she did meet him first means something. Because she will remember that, not so much that, yes, she met him first, but what he said when they met, how well he knew her and connected to her right away, how he knew she wasn't Katherine so quickly. That stuff will matter. And it also showed something that we know for sure, but Elena didn't, or wouldn't remember in terms of the kind of guy Damon was capable of being even when they first met. We saw as early as episode three ("Friday Night Bites"), that softer, sweeter side of Damon that Elena was able to bring out. She'll fully be aware of that now.

Yes, this scene has to mean something. It made Damon want to fight, it was made to contradict Elena's musing, it also tied in with what she told Matt about Damon consuming her. The fact the writers had her use the exact same word Damon told her about what she wanted can't be a coincidence.

Arabian: Elena01arabian on May 15th, 2012 11:43 am (UTC)
First, awesome post is awesome. *puts in memories* And congrats to you for trying to be as unbiased as possible and look back on your own entries to analize your way of thinking.

Thank you, m'dear. I just love this show so much so I'm glad I was able to get past my issues. :)

Yeah, the loss of Human!Elena hit me hard. I have started to accept it though.

As I mentioned in the other post, I've decided that while I do want that, I don't want it until season 05 or even early season 06, because I think we should deal with her being a vampire again. Maybe by the time that happens, she'll be with Damon, and she'll get turned human. And we'll get that choice after all of her deciding that nope, she wants to be a vampire WITH Damon. Could happen.

Elena took for granted she'd still see Damon again, that he'd still be part of her life even after she didn't choose him, even when she supposedly let him go.

Because she can't imagine her life without Damon because she really hasn't had to, and after all, he promised her he wouldn't leave her. Stefan has left her, and it hurt. She doesn't have to worry about that with Damon, he won't leave her.

You make a good point about the first ILY not being on the phone. I want it to be done properly.

Right?!

The reasoning behind choosing Stefan wasn't 'I love him so much, Damon, he's the one for me' or something, it was 'I love him and he came at a moment when I needed someone badly.' Which is definitely not the same thing.

Exactly. Yes, she loves Stefan, but being with him, choosing him is about SO MANY other factors that have nothing to do with loving him.

Also that kiss felt a little like a goobye kiss, there's no comparison with the Damon/Elena kisses. These are two people who haven't kissed in months (a year? I have no idea what the timeline is lol) and may be all in danger. There's no urgency, no passion in that maybe last kiss.

Yup. And distant_autumn made a really good point how she thought of Damon telling her to remember what she felt for him when Stefan is back ... and you could sign see that she was, she did. There's just no comparison with Stefan.

Yes, this scene has to mean something. It made Damon want to fight, it was made to contradict Elena's musing, it also tied in with what she told Matt about Damon consuming her. The fact the writers had her use the exact same word Damon told her about what she wanted can't be a coincidence.

Exactly, exactly. There was a LOT to take from this that is so positive about D/E.
vanimyvanimy on May 13th, 2012 11:07 pm (UTC)
PART TWO

BTW Thomas Galvin wrote yet another hilarious recap of the finale. Even though I don't agree with his views on Elena, I like the fact he's kinda unbiased when it comes to the ships because he doesn't give a damn about who ends up with whom. And even he said he felt the writers completely turned everything on its head with that flashback scene and it shows that no, Elena's choice isn't the final one.

And add to that, DAMON got the emotional fall-out of EVERYTHING. We didn't get to see Stefan learning that he was Elena's choice, and any possible happiness or joy that would have entailed. Instead we saw Elena's tears and heartbreak over letting Damon know that she wasn't choosing to be with him right now. We didn't see Stefan find out that Elena had died, his heartbreak and devastation over that ... nope, that was off-screen when he went back to get her after saving Matt. Instead we saw Damon realize that she was dead, saw his devastation on display. We didn't see Stefan find out that Elena would be a vampire; he already knew at the end, his disclosure had happened off-screen. Instead we saw Damon find out that she would turn. It was all about Damon's reaction to what was happening to Elena, viewers being put in Damon and Elena's emotional shoes about what was happening with the other.

Yes, yes, yes. You make such a great point here. We had Jeremy realize his sister was dead through Alaric's ghost, we had Damon's reaction, we didn't get Stefan's. Why didn't we get Stefan's? It could've easily been done. Stefan's grief at Elena's still body would have made a great scene. Him bringing her to the hospital in desperation and Meredith telling him Elena would be a vampire would have also made sense. Then they could have had Damon barging in later on and Stefan telling him what happened.

Yes, it was all about Damon's grief here. Damon fighting back because of that flashback, Damon being devastated, Damon barging into the hospital totally desperate, it was him who received the news.

I love this.

I totally agree with the fact Matt and Elena echoed more Stefan and Elena than Damon and Elena which explains my rage at first. Because I felt like the writers were forcing down our throat that Elena never loved Damon and she knew all along which drove me mad. Because Matt=Damon? Forever wrong.

I think had we seen the conversation with Caroline where Elena told her about happened in Denver, it would have helped tremendously to explain where Elena was coming from. That would have been a case of the viewers needing to be told something. Her telling Caroline that what happened freaked her out, that it was all too much, too overwhelming ... all of that would have made what happened in 3.22 make much more sense. We should have heard Elena talk about being consumed, her reaction to him, what she feels for him terrifying her, and that would have made sense as to why she chose the route of safety, the road she's comfortable with considering everything that was happening. But we didn't get that.

:o THIS. it totally would've made more sense with just this conversation added in.

It was one of the definite fails in the writing and execution of the second half of the season. Don't get me wrong, there were some great episodes in that second half, but overall, especially in the last three episodes, there was some major disconnect and story not shown or told that definitely needed to happen. The sudden defined need for Elena to make a choice was just, to put it frankly, stupidly, unnecessarily and badly done. Period. I already ranted about that after last week's episode. It felt more natural in this one, but it was still a bit too much tell, and not in a good way. And, of course, the fact that Stefan has not, and likely will not ever suffer ANY FREAKING CONSEQUENCES for the things he did is beyond frustrating.

Amen to this.

Arabian: Elena02arabian on May 15th, 2012 11:55 am (UTC)
BTW Thomas Galvin wrote yet another hilarious recap of the finale. Even though I don't agree with his views on Elena

His Elena-bashing just bothers me so much because I really am almost as much an Elena-fangirl as I am for Damon and Damon/Elena, so while I can appreciate the humor, his insulting of Elena (and Bonnie too) just bug me too much, alas.

even he said he felt the writers completely turned everything on its head with that flashback scene and it shows that no, Elena's choice isn't the final one.

I know that some D/Ers were pissed because it felt like stupid fanservice, but it really was so obviously more.

Yes, yes, yes. You make such a great point here.

Heh, apparently that paragraph of mine is being posted all around on tumblr, LOL!

We had Jeremy realize his sister was dead through Alaric's ghost, we had Damon's reaction, we didn't get Stefan's. Why didn't we get Stefan's? It could've easily been done. Stefan's grief at Elena's still body would have made a great scene. Him bringing her to the hospital in desperation and Meredith telling him Elena would be a vampire would have also made sense. Then they could have had Damon barging in later on and Stefan telling him what happened.

Exactly. Because it's NOT about Stefan and Elena. It's really not. Their pairing is just a means to an end for other characters and pairings. (BTW: Julie has said that Stefan doesn't know that he was her "choice," so we'll get that no doubt in season 04, but even there, it's going to be oh so bittersweet. Yeah.)

Yes, it was all about Damon's grief here. Damon fighting back because of that flashback, Damon being devastated, Damon barging into the hospital totally desperate, it was him who received the news.

I love this.


*Sigh* I know, right?! Looking at it all now through this lens, it was SO, SO good for D/E.

I totally agree with the fact Matt and Elena echoed more Stefan and Elena than Damon and Elena which explains my rage at first. Because I felt like the writers were forcing down our throat that Elena never loved Damon and she knew all along which drove me mad. Because Matt=Damon? Forever wrong.

Right, I got that sense the first time I watched it too. But the parallel wasn't Matt = Damon, but rather her lack of willingness to accept what she felt for Matt = her lack of willingness to accept what she feels for Damon.

RE: -- [I think had we seen the conversation with Caroline where Elena told her about happened in Denver, it would have helped tremendously to explain where Elena was coming from.]

:o THIS. it totally would've made more sense with just this conversation added in.


That REALLY should have happened. Ah well.

RE: Lack of consequences for Stefan. This is my new philosophy. They are clearly not writing an episode by episode or season by season tale, they are doing the whole six years journey. And I've been pleased so much overall with so much, that I'm going to trust that we will get Stefan to where he needs to be with a realization that he isn't the "good" brother, and has to make better decisions by the end of the six years because there have been too many lines, too many moments, too many things that point to the fact that Elena is making mistakes with regards to Stefan, and that Stefan's way of doing things isn't the best way. It's just going to be a journey that lasts longer than one season. I just have to believe that that's intentional for now and that it will be eventually dealt with along the journey. If at the end of the show's run, I'm wrong, well, that's egg on my face, but there's just been too much, too much in between the lines that point to the fact that something will come of it.
(no subject) - vanimy on May 20th, 2012 09:13 pm (UTC) (Expand)
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vanimyvanimy on May 13th, 2012 11:08 pm (UTC)
PART THREE

I *think* what happened is that Kevin Williamson was around helping to lay out the first half, not as much as he had in seasons past, but enough that his guiding hand was there because he only had The Secret Circle to contend with as well. However, he then began work on his Pilot for Fox, and I wonder if with his concentration on that and The Secret Circle, he left The Vampire Diaries in the hands of Julie Plec and the producers. Hopefully, with The Secret Circle canceled, he will be able to devote time to TVD -- at least as much as he did in the first half of season 03. (Which delivered some of my absolute favorite episodes.)

I really hope so. I think his writing is a little bit more... mature, maybe? He's good at plots, pacing and twists. Much better than JP.

Re: Elena turning against her will. Even though I liked your theory about Elena turning to be with Damon, I knew the show would never go that route because it would've looked too much like Twilight. And we all know they want to be very different from Twilight (with reason).

Re : Stefan/Elena being the bump on the road for Damon/Elena. I really hope so too. But -playing devil's advocate here- it could also be Stefan and Elena overcoming yet another obstacle. Stefan could and probably will have issues with Elena being different, being a vampire and Elena would be even more attracted to Damon now but all this could be overcome by the end of season 4. Again. It could happen. I've seen writers completely dismiss everything about their own characters just because of their endgame ships. So it could happen with the TVD writers too.

So I'm choosing to hope... but cautiously. I still hope for Damon/Elena, I will be happy with the meager bones we'll be thrown next season but I'll be prepared in case the worst case scenario - ie, Damon being just an obstacle to the Stelena true epic love - comes true. That way I won't get hurt like I did after this finale.

- Damon is awesome. My single favorite part of the episode was his "No, no, no, no, no..." over the speaker phone during the group pow-wow. Every moment with him was awesome, good, heartbreaking, fantastic and damn funny. In other words, typical Damon. :D

A thousand times YES. I just love the fact that Damon's the only character who's always always been written coherently. His actions never made me scratch my head in wonder. I LOVE HIM. And that's also probably why I can't quit the show even if I wanted to. As long as Damon stays Damon, I'll still be in.

And, oh my, Damon realizing that Alaric was dying, double-horrific for him, watching his friend die (a second time really), and knowing that it meant that Elena was dead as well was just so beautifully, devastatingly handled by Ian Somerhalder.

Yes, he killed that scene.

Arabian: Elena03arabian on May 15th, 2012 12:08 pm (UTC)
Re: KWilliamson -- I really hope so. I think his writing is a little bit more... mature, maybe? He's good at plots, pacing and twists. Much better than JP.

Yeah, I think working together, they create magic, but there was too much sloppiness too much in the second half that I think suffered a tad due to his lack of attention.

Re: Elena turning against her will. Even though I liked your theory about Elena turning to be with Damon, I knew the show would never go that route because it would've looked too much like Twilight. And we all know they want to be very different from Twilight (with reason).

I like my new hopeful theory, that after she's been a vampire for awhile, then a spell turns her human again, she makes the choice to be with Damon as a vampire because she's lived both sides, you know?

Re : Stefan/Elena being the bump on the road for Damon/Elena. I really hope so too. But -playing devil's advocate here- it could also be Stefan and Elena overcoming yet another obstacle.

Then why isn't the focus on them? Just look at this finale, so many moments that SHOULD have gone to Stefan, if S/E were THE couple.

Stefan could and probably will have issues with Elena being different, being a vampire and Elena would be even more attracted to Damon now but all this could be overcome by the end of season 4.

It could, but that doesn't track with everything we've seen.

It could happen. I've seen writers completely dismiss everything about their own characters just because of their endgame ships. So it could happen with the TVD writers too.

Well, we already know that as early as late season 01, each EP had a particular endgame couple in mind, and considering the writing since then, I think it's a very safe bet to say that the one rooting for D/E convinced the other of S/E. :)

So I'm choosing to hope... but cautiously. I still hope for Damon/Elena, I will be happy with the meager bones we'll be thrown next season but I'll be prepared in case the worst case scenario - ie, Damon being just an obstacle to the Stelena true epic love - comes true. That way I won't get hurt like I did after this finale.

I think we'll have a fairly good idea by the midseason what direction they're going. This season, instead of just focusing on D/E, I'm going to focus on the S/E stuff too and not just dismiss it to lessen their story. That was my problem this season.

I just love the fact that Damon's the only character who's always always been written coherently. His actions never made me scratch my head in wonder.

Heh, I actually did have problems with him in ONE episode (but one out of sixty-six is not bad at all!). ("Klaus," if you're wondering. I don't think you were around my journal then, if not, here's a link.) Overall, though, yes, I completely agree. Damon is the very definition of awesome-sauce. :D

As long as Damon stays Damon, I'll still be in.

Ditto. Damon/Ian, yeah.
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vanimy: D/Evanimy on May 13th, 2012 11:08 pm (UTC)
PART FOUR

- What wasn't beautiful or devastating in any good way was the lack of emotional connection between Stefan and Damon. They believe they are going to die, gone for good and when they talk on the phone they have barely any words to say about each other, their love, their relationship? Instead it's just all about Elena? Really? Yeah, not loving that.

Yeah, I was peeved by this too. What a wasted opportunity.

Re : Tyler, I'm not even paying attention to his lines anymore, lol. Worst character still on the show IMO.

I think they just have to bring back Joseph Morgan, he IS Klaus. Trevino did such a bad job I didn't even understand he was possessed by klaus on first viewing. I thought Tyler had made a deal with Bonnie because he didn't want to die or something, lol.

- You know all know that I love me some Elijah, but why the hell was he there? He brought ABSOLUTELY nothing to the episode. That was complete and utter fanservice. Seeing him and Rebekah connect for a bit and hug was sweet, though. Yeah.

LOL, yeah, Elijah served no purpose whatsoever. But I don't care, because seeing him standing there in Elena's house was my only squee of the episode and his hug with Rebekah was my favorite part of the episode (finally some love shown between two Originals siblings...).

I love Rebekah but I can't see Damon forging any sort of partnership with her anymore. Because this time she really killed Elena so no. Especially after the fact he saved her life, I don't think he'll ever get past it. I wouldn't even be surprised if he tried to kill her. (He's got the super stake now, hasn't he?).

- I don't want Damon sexing up Meredith either, because I'd like them to genuinely become friends. Period. No sex. Just friends. And, yeah, I want Meredith to stick around because I do genuinely like her. There's just a sweetness about Torrey Devitto's performance that I enjoy.

Yeah. I saw people thinking Damon should fall in love with Meredith and just no. it would totally contradict Damon's character, you know the guy who stayed freakin' celibate for 50 years because the woman he loved at the time was stuck in a tomb. The guy who loves Elena passionately even after her telling him she doesn't feel the same way repeatedly. And the Damon/Elena shipper in me does accept Damon sexing up other women but NO FEELINGS FOR SOMEONE ELSE, JUST NO.

Besides I'd like that Meredith could be the only one immune to Damon's charms, lol. I would love a friendship between them. Also Meredith really grew on me too. There is something so sweet about her and her concern for everyone who was involved wiht Alaric even if Alaric is no longer there.



Edited at 2012-05-13 11:14 pm (UTC)
Arabian: Damon & Elena09arabian on May 15th, 2012 12:34 pm (UTC)
Re : Tyler, I'm not even paying attention to his lines anymore, lol. Worst character still on the show IMO.

So agreed. God, why can't they just kill him off? *sigh*

I think they just have to bring back Joseph Morgan, he IS Klaus.

It's already been confirmed that it will be a short possession, like Klaus possessing Ric in season 02. Thank goodness!

Trevino did such a bad job I didn't even understand he was possessed by klaus on first viewing. I thought Tyler had made a deal with Bonnie because he didn't want to die or something, lol.

LOL!

LOL, yeah, Elijah served no purpose whatsoever. But I don't care, because seeing him standing there in Elena's house was my only squee of the episode and his hug with Rebekah was my favorite part of the episode (finally some love shown between two Originals siblings...).

Aww, Damon was my squee! And I was so devastated at that point, that I couldn't even enjoy that moment with E/R. I really do need to sit down and rewatch it all.

I love Rebekah but I can't see Damon forging any sort of partnership with her anymore. Because this time she really killed Elena so no. Especially after the fact he saved her life, I don't think he'll ever get past it. I wouldn't even be surprised if he tried to kill her. (He's got the super stake now, hasn't he?).

Hmm, good point. But like Elena, Damon also appears to have pretty deep levels of forgiveness. We'll see. I'm fine with D/R having a cagey, non-friendly relationship at this point. I do not want anymore sexing between them as explained in my post above.

I saw people thinking Damon should fall in love with Meredith and just no. it would totally contradict Damon's character, you know the guy who stayed freakin' celibate for 50 years because the woman he loved at the time was stuck in a tomb. The guy who loves Elena passionately even after her telling him she doesn't feel the same way repeatedly. And the Damon/Elena shipper in me does accept Damon sexing up other women but NO FEELINGS FOR SOMEONE ELSE, JUST NO.

For real!?! God, people! I'd like to see limited sexing of others though, I know it will happen, but geez, I'm SO FREAKING TIRED OF IT at this point. Yes, yes, I know this would mean less naked Ian, but it's not like there isn't a lot of past moments to drool over.

Besides I'd like that Meredith could be the only one immune to Damon's charms, lol.

I'm not even thinking immune, just deciding that no matter how hot he is, she wants to be his friend because she knows that there is more to him because of his friendship with Ric, the last couple episodes, and she realizes that he needs a friend.

I would love a friendship between them. Also Meredith really grew on me too. There is something so sweet about her and her concern for everyone who was involved with Alaric even if Alaric is no longer there.

Exactly. Yeah.
(no subject) - vanimy on May 20th, 2012 09:34 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - arabian on May 21st, 2012 04:17 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - vanimy on June 3rd, 2012 01:03 pm (UTC) (Expand)
vanimy: D/E kissvanimy on May 13th, 2012 11:09 pm (UTC)
PART FIVE ( I feel like I'm spamming your LJ lol)

I love Bonnie too but I did get the Dark!bonnie vibes myself. Mostly because of the episode before the finale. She did use dark magic when she did that spell on Klaus and who knows how she made that spell with Klaus? So yeah, I think they are going there. And I don't mind because Bonnie would finally get a decent storyline of her own.

Matt and Jeremy are the best for real. They're on my very small list of people who just can't die. Which is why I was actually glad Stefan saved him in the water. Because i knew Elena couldn't really die while Matt very well could.

About Elena making the decision for everyone, YES. I almost wanted Damon to say 'Screw this, I'm sticking to the original plan and continuing my trip.' Loved Damon's response though about how Elena's choices are always bad, lol.

- Lastly, the flashbacks. Sadly, I feel like Jenna was wasted, and I felt zero connection between Elena and her parents. Ah well.

YES, YES. These flashbacks were really useless.

The one flashback that didn't work frustrated me because it was so beautifully filmed and acted with lovely music. Alas, there was so much stupidity on display that I couldn't appreciate those aspects of the scene. What stupidity may you ask? Well...

1. Did Rebekah just stand there on the hopeful off-chance that Elena would come driving that way? How the hell did she know that Elena was coming? Only Matt and Jeremy knew of the 'take Elena out of Mystic Falls' plan.

2. Stefan is a vampire, how come he couldn't carry both from the water? Sure, he's probably not fast underwater as he is on land, but he still has the strength.

3. Okay, fine, he couldn't carry both, then why didn't he at least rip Elena's seatbelt off? She was conscious, she could have tried to swim on her own if he had done so.

4. The fact that I believe we're supposed to think that what Stefan did in respecting Elena's wish to save Matt and not herself was heroic and romantic. Yeah, uhm, nope. You save the person you love, not their friend, even if they'll be pissed at you. Once again, Stefan put wanting Elena to have a positive perception of him over wanting Elena alive. For reals. Not romantic. Not heroic. No.


OMG THIS. All this. I thought the scene was beautifully shot but all this stupidity really took me out of it. Also, Elena and her dad opening their mouths and apparently breathing through water really really took me out of it too. It's bad enough people always hold their breaths for so long in fiction but actually like talking and all, just no. It was stupid.

I still think JP could've been more considerate and understanding of people's reactions. I mean, of course the Delena shippers were bound to react negatively, what else did she expect?? She could have told us she understood the hurt everyone experienced but to just hang in there instead of acting all condescending to her own fans. Ugh.
Diana: Vampire Diaries - Comfort (E/C)butterfly on May 14th, 2012 12:13 pm (UTC)
I still think JP could've been more considerate and understanding of people's reactions. I mean, of course the Delena shippers were bound to react negatively, what else did she expect?? She could have told us she understood the hurt everyone experienced but to just hang in there instead of acting all condescending to her own fans. Ugh.

What gets to me about Julie is that when the Stefan/Elena shippers were being miserable as a result of what was happening with the triangle she did act understanding and she was soothing them. So, that she was so much more considerate to the S/E shippers than the D/E ones gets to me. And if anything makes me doubt arabian's lovely analysis, it's the way Julie treats D/E shippers vs how she treats S/E shippers. If the endgame is really supposed to be Damon/Elena, why is she so much nicer and understanding with the Stefan/Elena fans?
(no subject) - arabian on May 14th, 2012 12:44 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - butterfly on May 14th, 2012 12:55 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - arabian on May 14th, 2012 06:20 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - vanimy on May 20th, 2012 09:38 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - arabian on May 15th, 2012 12:57 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - vanimy on May 20th, 2012 09:48 pm (UTC) (Expand)
shipperjunkieshipperjunkie on May 14th, 2012 01:42 am (UTC)
I'm so glad you got there. I got there yesterday as well. I'm more hopeful than ever now, and for the exact reasons you wrote so eloquently about.
Arabian: Damon12arabian on May 14th, 2012 05:44 pm (UTC)
Yeah, it took awhile, but I feel REALLY good about it now. :)
x5valex5vale on May 14th, 2012 11:01 am (UTC)
Very great insight.

I wasn't disappointed about the D/E part of the episode, I actually felt like that was the real start of a very balanced relationship because in the whole season I haven't seen Elena really exploring her feelings for Damon but in the last few episodes and this was not enough for me. So yep, I will regret that Damon won't have a chance with human!Elena, but again I don't think she will lose it for good. None of them do. Not even Katherine or Klaus.

I am with you about the payoff for S/E. It's not enough, it's not because Elena loves Stefan per Stefan. it's because he is her first love, it's because he is the link to her previous life, the last bond to her parents...I have not heard once from her that she loves Stefan because of Stefan personality. It's by default. She is going to change her mind, especially now that everything she knows is going to change.

Let me say, it's been great to be here, discussing with you. It was a long, interesting ride :)
Arabian: Damon02arabian on May 14th, 2012 06:32 pm (UTC)
Very great insight.

Thank you. :)

I wasn't disappointed about the D/E part of the episode, I actually felt like that was the real start of a very balanced relationship because in the whole season I haven't seen Elena really exploring her feelings for Damon but in the last few episodes and this was not enough for me. So yep, I will regret that Damon won't have a chance with human!Elena, but again I don't think she will lose it for good. None of them do. Not even Katherine or Klaus.

True. And knowing Elena, she will fight tooth and nail to keep her humanity. She wouldn't ever go for that switch.

I am with you about the payoff for S/E. It's not enough, it's not because Elena loves Stefan per Stefan. it's because he is her first love, it's because he is the link to her previous life, the last bond to her parents...I have not heard once from her that she loves Stefan because of Stefan personality. It's by default. She is going to change her mind, especially now that everything she knows is going to change.

Yup. I was just so burned by no fall-out for Stefan, and so convinced that she would choose Damon and when she didn't, I couldn't see past my disappointment. I'm so glad I calmed down and did. :)

Let me say, it's been great to be here, discussing with you. It was a long, interesting ride :)

Agreed. And we still got three more seasons to go, woohoo!!
Diana: Vampire Diaries - Not Leaving (D/E)butterfly on May 14th, 2012 12:41 pm (UTC)
I still have doubts (I mention one of the main things that gets to me in my comment to vanimy in this post)! I don't know if I'll be able to ever really trust the writers again after this season. But this post is a beautiful one. I might have to skip some of the early S4 episodes if they look particularly S/E-heavy. I am just tired of watching Stefan manipulate her and the writers not notice that's what he's doing.

Okay, details.

Now I feel like I've gone through the five stages of grief, and I reached acceptance yesterday afternoon

I saw someone else say this about the finale, too, and it's so apt! It really did feel like grieving. There was the confusion and the denial - did that really happen? - the anger, the sadness, wanting things to be different. Then comes acceptance. I don't know if I'm there yet. Ha. I've always been stubborn.

Elena told Damon that it would always be in Stefan at the beginning of season 02. Damon repeated those words back to her on his deathbed at the end of season 02, and she didn't, couldn't deny it. However, at the end of season 03, when Damon repeated those words again, she told him that she didn't know about always, only what she was feeling in that moment. That's a HUGE difference in attitude, and WHY we had the Damon/Elena growth in season 03. In "The Return," it was "I care about you, but I love Stefan, it will always be Stefan." Here, yes, she told him again that she cared about him, but she loved Stefan and he said "always, Stefan" and she DENIED that certainty. Elena couldn't say that always now, because she realizes now that she doesn't know that it will always be Stefan, she just knows that right now it is. This ties back to "Our Town" when Elena told Damon that what was happening between them wasn't right, and he said it was right, just not "right now."

I do see the point here, I just think that it was more weakly-written than it should have been. It shouldn't take time to realize, "oh, Elena isn't just calling Damon to twist a knife in his guts before he dies; she has progressed since the S2 premiere", you know? I mean, my initial reaction to that phonecall was how cruel and horrible it felt to have her call him up to tell him that she doesn't love him; that was my initial reaction to it - how incredibly cruel. So, if it was meant to be kind, it really came off the wrong way to me (and to other people, from what I've seen people saying).

One of the things that Julie Plec said in the post-finale interviews is that when they wrote "The Last Day" in season 02, they knew that it would be the last romantic Stefan/Elena episode for about a year, and so this episode was the romantic payoff for that long, hard in-between where they were separated and awful things happened. And to that I say, really? That was the pay-off? An Elena who chose Stefan almost by default. An Elena who found it heartbreakingly difficult to choose him over his brother. An Elena who, when talking to Matt about her feelings for him, spoke about the perception of love and what it should be and how that related to Stefan as opposed to Stefan himself alone, paired with saying that when she's with Damon, he consumes her. An Elena who barely reacted to the first kiss they've shared in six months. That was the emotional payoff? If that were Damon and Elena and that was my payoff, I would not be a happy camper. At all.

lol, yeah, I mentioned this in one of our phone calls, I think - that if I were a Stefan/Elena fan, I would feel cheated by the reasoning that Elena uses for choosing him. It does come across as obligation - what she 'should' do versus what she would really want to do if she let herself.

Edited at 2012-05-14 04:17 pm (UTC)
Arabian: Damon & Elena12arabian on May 15th, 2012 01:34 pm (UTC)
I still have doubts [...]I don't know if I'll be able to ever really trust the writers again after this season.

As I said in the other post, they are clearing writing a six-season journey here and to expect resolution on anything before then fully likely won't happen. There really have been lines and signs pointing to the wrongness of Stefan's actions, so I'm holding on.

But this post is a beautiful one.

I might have to skip some of the early S4 episodes if they look particularly S/E-heavy. I am just tired of watching Stefan manipulate her and the writers not notice that's what he's doing.

I think maybe they do know now, but yeah, it's gonna not be recognized, dealt with fully until we get closer to the end of the series. Again, c/ping from my last post -- Considering that we had Rose say that Damon challenges Elena, and had Matt say that Stefan should challenge Elena, that we will get there about Stefan.
Okay, details.

I saw someone else say this about the finale, too, and it's so apt! It really did feel like grieving. There was the confusion and the denial - did that really happen? - the anger, the sadness, wanting things to be different. Then comes acceptance. I don't know if I'm there yet. Ha. I've always been stubborn.

I am absolutely hopeful again. :)

I do see the point here, I just think that it was more weakly-written than it should have been. It shouldn't take time to realize, "oh, Elena isn't just calling Damon to twist a knife in his guts before he dies; she has progressed since the S2 premiere", you know?

The funny thing is that, yeah, distant_autumn did see it right away, LOL! I think for us, it was all about those expectations and we were focusing so completely on the Damon-side of the equation, and not the Stefan (and Elena's legitimate feelings for him)-side of things. And, honestly, that's not the writer's fail, that's ours. Of course, I told you already, I never thought that Elena was trying to hurt him, even my first watch through. It just hurt because I wanted Damon to get the choice, but I could tell how much she cared for him during it.

I mean, my initial reaction to that phonecall was how cruel and horrible it felt to have her call him up to tell him that she doesn't love him; that was my initial reaction to it - how incredibly cruel. So, if it was meant to be kind, it really came off the wrong way to me (and to other people, from what I've seen people saying).

That is definitely true. I think, honestly, that it just couldn't hurt any other way unless for most unless we weren't emotionally invested, or like distant_autumn watched them all in a batch.

RE; - S/E payoff -- yeah, I mentioned this in one of our phone calls, I think - that if I were a Stefan/Elena fan, I would feel cheated by the reasoning that Elena uses for choosing him. It does come across as obligation - what she 'should' do versus what she would really want to do if she let herself.

Exactly. And I was just too upset, and NOT looking at it from the S/E point of view to see that.
Dianabutterfly on May 14th, 2012 12:41 pm (UTC)
part 2
I think had we seen the conversation with Caroline where Elena told her about happened in Denver, it would have helped tremendously to explain where Elena was coming from. That would have been a case of the viewers needing to be told something. Her telling Caroline that what happened freaked her out, that it was all too much, too overwhelming ... all of that would have made what happened in 3.22 make much more sense. We should have heard Elena talk about being consumed, her reaction to him, what she feels for him terrifying her, and that would have made sense as to why she chose the route of safety, the road she's comfortable with considering everything that was happening. But we didn't get that.

Would have made things so much better. That was a big problem this season, I think - missing scenes.

We also needed scenes of Ric struggling against his dark side so that we understood that he wasn't just randomly being an asshole to Damon and not caring about him anymore.

Damon is awesome. My single favorite part of the episode was his "No, no, no, no, no..." over the speaker phone during the group pow-wow. Every moment with him was awesome, good, heartbreaking, fantastic and damn funny. In other words, typical Damon. :D

Damon has been pitch-perfect this season, hasn't he? He hasn't had any of the weird/under-written/false moments of the other characters. Even the big out-of-character episode, "Disturbing Behavior", Damon was perfectly Damon. It was the other people who were acting weird, judge-y, and reactionary (which I guess for Alaric was the ring acting on him and, for Elena, was her trying to make Damon be Stefan for her).

What wasn't beautiful or devastating in any good way was the lack of emotional connection between Stefan and Damon. They believe they are going to die, gone for good and when they talk on the phone they have barely any words to say about each other, their love, their relationship? Instead it's just all about Elena? Really? Yeah, not loving that.

This gave me a major frowny-face, as you know. His relationship with Damon is the part of Stefan that I like the most, so when that gets downplayed, I get sad.

As for Matt, I loved how he continues to be such a great friend to Elena despite their past. Oh, and how he seems to be way more Team!Damon than he is Team!Stefan, which makes sense on a few levels. Stefan is the guy that Elena hooked up with after she broke up with Matt, that sting will likely always be there. Also, Damon saved his life when Tyler was going to attack him and Caroline, and stopped Kol from doing anything beyond breaking his hand. And I loved that Matt had the same point of view that Damon has about Stefan's way of "respecting" Elena's decisions... which generally lead to her almost dying. Or, you know, actually dying! The fact that such a point was brought up gives me a wee bit of hope (but certainly nothing I'm sure of) that maybe, just maybe, Stefan's way of putting Elena's positive perception of him over discussing and disagreeing with her is not 100% kosher.

And when Stefan just sits things out, refrains from having an opinion, and just cedes control over everything affecting both of their lives to Elena - she dies. She died last season and only lived because of John; she dies this season and only lives because of Meredith (and probably via Damon's blood). Stefan's inability to realize that submission is not the same as respect literally gets Elena killed. Telling someone that a stupid plan is stupid is not disrespectful. I think that Damon lands between Stefan and Matt on this issue - he talks a big game about tying Elena up and keeping her out of trouble but we saw back in the early part of S3 that what he actually does is talk to and negotiate with her as an equal rather than either drugging her or giving way to her every decision.

(the weird thing to me is how Stefan manages to come across both as incredibly passive and as so manipulative - I guess it's because he controls people by being passive a lot of the time; head-games and behind-the-scenes manipulation)

But I have no clue if the writers have any clue what they're writing. That's the thing that this season has made me doubt.

Edited at 2012-05-14 03:24 pm (UTC)
Arabian: Rebekah01arabian on May 15th, 2012 01:39 pm (UTC)
Re - Elena talking to Caroline about overwhelming Damon feelings scene -- Would have made things so much better. That was a big problem this season, I think - missing scenes.

I really think/hope that it was because of Kevin Williamson's absence, and fingers crossed that won't be such an issue next season.

We also needed scenes of Ric struggling against his dark side so that we understood that he wasn't just randomly being an asshole to Damon and not caring about him anymore.

YES! EMPHATICALLY YES!

Damon has been pitch-perfect this season, hasn't he?

Yup. Absolutely. I had issues with him in "Klaus" last season, and while I was all hot for him and loved the snark, he was a total asshole/douchebag (especially to Caroline) in the first half of season 01. But this season? UTTER PERFECTION!

He hasn't had any of the weird/under-written/false moments of the other characters. Even the big out-of-character episode, "Disturbing Behavior", Damon was perfectly Damon. It was the other people who were acting weird, judge-y, and reactionary (which I guess for Alaric was the ring acting on him and, for Elena, was her trying to make Damon be Stefan for her).

Yup, the issues with DB in retrospect ... work, but even during the initial airing, Damon made sense.

This gave me a major frowny-face, as you know. His relationship with Damon is the part of Stefan that I like the most, so when that gets downplayed, I get sad.

I can't downplay this fail because six-season journey or not, we SHOULD have gotten the boys talking about themselves there. Period.

Awhen Stefan just sits things out, refrains from having an opinion, and just cedes control over everything affecting both of their lives to Elena - she dies. She died last season and only lived because of John; she dies this season and only lives because of Meredith (and probably via Damon's blood). Stefan's inability to realize that submission is not the same as respect literally gets Elena killed. Telling someone that a stupid plan is stupid is not disrespectful. I think that Damon lands between Stefan and Matt on this issue - he talks a big game about tying Elena up and keeping her out of trouble but we saw back in the early part of S3 that what he actually does is talk to and negotiate with her as an equal rather than either drugging her or giving way to her every decision.

(the weird thing to me is how Stefan manages to come across both as incredibly passive and as so manipulative - I guess it's because he controls people by being passive a lot of the time; head-games and behind-the-scenes manipulation)

But I have no clue if the writers have any clue what they're writing. That's the thing that this season has made me doubt.


Keeping all of this, because again, we DID have Rose mention Damon challenging Elena. We did have Matt challenging Stefan on this. And every time Stefan pulls this shit, ELENA DIES! So, I'm looking at the full journey here and choosing to be optimistic. :)
sun_signsun_sign on May 14th, 2012 03:51 pm (UTC)
How did you manage to write all of that down when I felt exhausted just reading it? WITCHCRAFT!
Arabian: Katherine01arabian on May 14th, 2012 04:21 pm (UTC)
IT'S MAGIC!! (And uber-wordiness. And a desperate desire to reclaim my EXUBERANT love for this show.)
vamplover85vamplover85 on May 14th, 2012 07:31 pm (UTC)
t, DAMON got the emotional fall-out of EVERYTHING. We didn't get to see Stefan learning that he was Elena's choice, and any possible happiness or joy that would have entailed. Instead we saw Elena's tears and heartbreak over letting Damon know that she wasn't choosing to be with him right now. We didn't see Stefan find out that Elena had died, his heartbreak and devastation over that ... nope, that was off-screen when he went back to get her after saving Matt. Instead we saw Damon realize that she was dead, saw his devastation on display. We didn't see Stefan find out that Elena would be a vampire; he already knew at the end, his disclosure had happened off-screen. Instead we saw Damon find out that she would turn. It was all about Damon's reaction to what was happening to Elena, viewers being put in Damon and Elena's emotional shoes about what was happening with the other.
THIS part is all around TUMBLR. :P But we didn't see a whole lot going on both sides. It was way off. Did you know that the ending part and the meeting part was in the books?

Arabian: Arya Starkarabian on May 14th, 2012 07:38 pm (UTC)
What do you mean "THIS part is all around TUMBLR?"

But we didn't see a whole lot going on both sides.

No, that's my point, we did see a lot from the Damon/Elena angle, what we saw from the Stefan/Elena was fairly superficial.

Did you know that the ending part and the meeting part was in the books?

No, but I haven't read the books and I really have no desire to, LOL!
(no subject) - vamplover85 on May 14th, 2012 07:42 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - arabian on May 14th, 2012 07:45 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - vamplover85 on May 14th, 2012 07:54 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - arabian on May 15th, 2012 01:39 pm (UTC) (Expand)
Florenciaflorencia7 on May 14th, 2012 10:44 pm (UTC)
Thank you SO MUCH for this awesome, brilliant, beautiful post! ♥

You're so right about expectations. I can see that now too. I remember having a *feeling* that the season would end on a SE note back at the very beginning already when that SE phone call scene in 3x01 happened. It would have just defied Elena's personality-based logic to have her assure Stefan of her love, tell him to hold on to that love & then at the end of the season cut him off. But I buried that feeling deep down & chose to go with my DE expectations instead.

Well, I'm probably making a similar mistake again drawing the following conclusions ^^, but I found it very interesting that in the finale we got two kisses: Matt/Elena (in a flashback) and Stefan/Elena, which somehow put them in the same category of things past ;)
Arabian: Damon & Elena20arabian on May 15th, 2012 02:13 pm (UTC)
Thank you SO MUCH for this awesome, brilliant, beautiful post! ♥

If it helped at all with any issues with the finale, I'm glad. :)

You're so right about expectations. I can see that now too. I remember having a *feeling* that the season would end on a SE note back at the very beginning already when that SE phone call scene in 3x01 happened. It would have just defied Elena's personality-based logic to have her assure Stefan of her love, tell him to hold on to that love & then at the end of the season cut him off. But I buried that feeling deep down & chose to go with my DE expectations instead.

Yup, a big problem along with the expectations is that I essentially glossed over the S/E aspects and moments, and denied their importance because I didn't want to even think of Elena being with Stefan anymore.

Well, I'm probably making a similar mistake again drawing the following conclusions ^^, but I found it very interesting that in the finale we got two kisses: Matt/Elena (in a flashback) and Stefan/Elena, which somehow put them in the same category of things past ;)

Ooh, very good point! :D
flyingfish: elena tvdflyingfish1 on May 15th, 2012 02:55 am (UTC)
\o/

It's true what you say about expectations! This year has been my first time really participating in this fandom and writing episode reaction posts, and if there's one thing I've learned from the experience it's that I always want to extrapolate like crazy from the limited info we get each week, and that each week I'm dead wrong, LOL! Not that the season as a whole doesn't mostly hang together, in retrospect, just that I never know what details to focus on. You just can't properly analyse a story arc until you know where it's all headed.

A question for you: since you expected DE to get together at the end of this season, did you expect SE to get back together at any point? I ask because I've been thinking about my own expectations and realizing that I did expect pretty much all of this (SE reuniting briefly for closure, Elena becoming a vamp at a time when she and Damon were on the outs so that remembering his compulsion from 2x08 would have a greater effect on her) to happen, I just didn't expect any of it to happen as early in the story as it actually did and I expected a season or so of DE to come in between. Because of that I don't think I'm as rattled as a lot of DE shippers seem to be. But I know you wanted her to turn specifically to be with Damon, for one thing, so I can see why you were so disconcerted at first.

I'd be lying if I said that I wasn't upset that we're not going to get Human!Elena and Damon.

But but but we kindasorta did, though!! In a way. If you squint. Or rather, we could have, if it weren't for the car crash. The way I look at it is, the important thing we learned from the flashback isn't that she met Damon before she met Stefan--that's practically irrelevant--it's that she met him and liked him before her parents died and the resulting trauma turned all her priorities inside out. It broke her. But before that happened, back when she was emotionally healthy and whole, she met him and flirted with him, implying that yes, she was interested in him and the passionate, adventurous, dangerous relationship he represented. She clings to Stefan now because he's safe, but as she starts to heal and get back to her old self she becomes more and more drawn to Damon--until Alaric's death breaks her all over again and she goes back to square one. But the point isn't that human!Elena didn't want Damon, it's that damaged!Elena didn't. The human Elena from two years prior was certainly liking the idea very much.

*cough* I'm thinking of writing a post on that and you just got the rough draft...

Stefan won't be comfortable with Elena, the vampire. I agree. Not that he won't help her adjust, but I can't help thinking of him telling Lexi that part of the reason he loves her is that when he's around her he completely forgets what he is. That might be harder now that she is that creature too. Relatedly, when he's not on a ripper binge Stefan doesn't enjoy being a vampire in the slightest so, while he was the person to make her feel happy to be alive, I don't see how he could possibly be the person to make her happy she's undead. Damon, on the other hand... Oh, did we handily get an ep about him learning to enjoy vampire life? I think we did :p

I didn't want Elena to become a vampire against her will. I wanted Elena to turn because it was her choice So did I, though it was all about her choice to die in Matt's place, so choice was a big part of it nevertheless. I'm satisfied with it.
Arabian: Elena10arabian on May 15th, 2012 02:42 pm (UTC)
Part 1 of 2 --

\o/

LOL! Yeah, my withdrawing from the show lasted long, huh?

It's true what you say about expectations! You just can't properly analyse a story arc until you know where it's all headed.

Yup, and not only that, I made an error in my analyzing in that I I essentially glossed over the S/E aspects and moments, and denied their importance because I didn't want to even think of Elena being with Stefan anymore.

A question for you: since you expected DE to get together at the end of this season, did you expect SE to get back together at any point?

I did; I expected them to get together for a few episodes, a short period before realizing it didn't work anymore with them. Then 3.11 happened and Stefan threatened to turn her and drive her off the bridge where her parents died, and I couldn't see how they could get back to even trying. I still think he took a step too far there, but I guess I'll just liken it to Damon snapping Jeremy's neck (which was never discussed between Damon and Elena). I had an issue, and thought the writers took it too far then, but I accepted it because I luuuurve Damon and Elena. I have to do the same for Stefan/Elena.

I ask because I've been thinking about my own expectations and realizing that I did expect pretty much all of this (SE reuniting briefly for closure, Elena becoming a vamp at a time when she and Damon were on the outs so that remembering his compulsion from 2x08 would have a greater effect on her) to happen

Yeah, I expected the S/E reunion, but once 3.11 happened, I let my frustration and lack of fangirling over that pairing to convince me that now it wouldn't happen. I never considered Elena turning this soon though.

I just didn't expect any of it to happen as early in the story as it actually did and I expected a season or so of DE to come in between.

Yeah, re: the turning.

Because of that I don't think I'm as rattled as a lot of DE shippers seem to be. But I know you wanted her to turn specifically to be with Damon, for one thing, so I can see why you were so disconcerted at first.

Yeah, that's what hurt. But I have a new hopeful theory that I'll cling to until that's cruelly ripped away from me too (LOL). I want some witchy voodoo to happen that turns Elena human again (we know it's possible because of Esther planning to do so to her kids). So now I want Elena as a vamp through to season 05 or even early season 06, because I think we should deal with her being a vampire. Maybe by the time that happens, she'll be with Damon (better be, grr!), and she'll get turned human. And we'll get that choice after all of her deciding that nope, she wants to be a vampire WITH Damon. Could happen. Because then she'll have experienced both sides, you know?

TBC
(no subject) - arabian on May 15th, 2012 02:43 pm (UTC) (Expand)
gidget_84gidget_84 on May 15th, 2012 05:30 am (UTC)
Yeah, after reading multiple people's reviews and just distancing myself from the whole "choice" thing I've come to accept it....mostly.
I have a friend who isn't into either Stelena or Delena, and she was complaining to me about why Delena shippers don't just stop complaining, because "everyone knows that Damon/Elena are endgame and Stefan is just like this obstacle in the way" lol so I mean, even non-shippers KNOW. And all of Julie's interviews that I've read recently, have basically said this, yeah Stefan/Elena will be together for a bit in S4, but that looking at the bigger picture Damon/Elena will win out in the end.

I'm still just grrr about Stefan not taking responsibility for his actions, because I mean, if they had just addressed this in the show, I wouldn't hate Stefan's narrative as much as I do. It's like a disservice to his character too, so I dunno, I just don't understand that.



Arabian: Rebekah01arabian on May 15th, 2012 02:47 pm (UTC)
Yeah, after reading multiple people's reviews and just distancing myself from the whole "choice" thing I've come to accept it....mostly.

Other than upset with needing more Alaric-nice-to-Damon prior, and Stefan/Damon-ness, I'm pretty much all there. :)

I have a friend who isn't into either Stelena or Delena, and she was complaining to me about why Delena shippers don't just stop complaining, because "everyone knows that Damon/Elena are endgame and Stefan is just like this obstacle in the way" lol so I mean, even non-shippers KNOW.

Hah! I love that.

And all of Julie's interviews that I've read recently, have basically said this, yeah Stefan/Elena will be together for a bit in S4, but that looking at the bigger picture Damon/Elena will win out in the end.

Well, I didn't get that she was saying the latter part, but the fact that she said what she did about S/E in season 04 actually has me hopeful that this really will be the last time we have to see them as a couple, even if they drag aspects of the triangle out longer.

I'm still just grrr about Stefan not taking responsibility for his actions, because I mean, if they had just addressed this in the show, I wouldn't hate Stefan's narrative as much as I do. It's like a disservice to his character too, so I dunno, I just don't understand that.

This is where I'm at now with that. Considering that we had Rose say that Damon challenges Elena, and had Matt say that Stefan should challenge Elena, that we will get there about Stefan. Realization will come that he needs to strike a balance that he's so far off. They are clearly not writing an episode by episode or season by season tale, they are doing the whole six years journey. And I've been pleased so much overall with so much, that I'm going to trust that we will get there by the end of the six years because there have been too many lines, too many moments, too many things that point to the fact that she is making mistakes, Stefan is making mistakes. It's just going to be a journey that lasts longer than one season. I just have to believe that that's intentional for now and that it will be eventually dealt with along the journey. If at the end of the show's run, I'm wrong, well, that's egg on my face, but there's just been too much, too much in between the lines that point to the fact that something will come of it.