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18 February 2011 @ 06:46 am
2.15 - 'The Dinner Party' (The Vampire Diaries)  
Uck, I've got a bug of some sorts, head-achey, tired, icky-feeling all-around, so I went to bed shortly after the episode. I wanted to get my thoughts out, though, so here I am. Not my most long-winded (yay, right? LOL), but here we go.

- I am sad to say that the flashbacks were kinda lame. *We really learned nothing about Stefan that we didn't already figure out. I just wasn't surprised or entertained by anything that happened in them. I dunno, maybe the Damon-fan in me is just anxious for some Damon-centric flashbacks, instead of Stefan, Stefan, Stefan. Whereas Stefan's "transformation" wasn't very surprising, I'm curious to see how Damon went from that guy to who we saw in the Pilot. That sounds like it would be something interesting and worth going through the effort for flashbacks. All of those scenes (except for the final one between Damon and Lexi) could have been shared in one scene from Stefan to Elena in a discussion without coming off as too expository.

* Reading my flist, I'm clearly in the minority here, LOL! I mean, yeah, the parallels of this is what Damon is going through now were clear, but they were already clear. We knew that we were seeing Damon go through what Stefan obviously had to have gone through at some point, but it's just gonna take longer and with more setbacks because Damon's been the big bad longer than Stefan was. So yeah, I still think the flashbacks were disappoint and a waste of perfectly good flashback-filming stuffs. :(

That Stefan was going after the founding families, especially the Gilberts, had promise, but other than that first scene, the execution was lacking. I don't know, maybe it's because of the fact that I'm possibly the only Vampire Diaries fan who was NOT in love with Lexi that I was kinda disappointed? And every time the reminder came up that Damon killed Lexi, I couldn't help but think, and saved Sheriff Forbes' life? Because I still wonder if that was part of Damon's plan, to blame it on Lexi, figuring she'd get away being a super-fast vampire and all that, but instead of escaping into the night, Lexi was about to rip Liz to shreds. It was Damon staking Lexi that saved her life. Funny how Stefan and *Elena* forget that part of the scene that played out. I'm not saying that Damon didn't expect the possibility (he had the stake handy), but the fact of the matter is that if that was the case, Lexi played right into his hands. Had she not turned to attack Liz, but instead tried to get the hell outta dodge once she got away from the deputies, Damon wouldn't have had to stake her. But, eh, what's Liz's life to Lexi's, right?

Yeah, yeah, I know, unapologetic Damon-stan here. *Sigh*

Anyhoo, back to current (erm, flashbacky?) events. When Elena said that that Stefan sounded like Damon, and Stefan said he was worse, I couldn't agree based on what we were seeing. He just seemed like a run-of-the-mill not-so-great vampire. And once again, the description of the "ripper" in vampire-world comes across as much less horrific as it did in the original sides describing it (Rose telling Elena in "Rose"). Oh, and once again, Elena barely bats an eye. And we even had dialogue that inferenced the fact that Stefan continues to tell Elena only bits and pieces despite promising to tell her everything. And it's completely glossed over as if it's not REALLY bad boyfriend behavior. Again.

This is why I didn't get my hopes up last week that we were beginning to see chinks in the armor with Stefan and Elena, something to show that the triangle is actually heading into that legitimate direction. Because we're just not seeing it. Sure, we see undercurrents and moments (that Elena has totally submerged) in scenes between Damon and Elena, but there is absolutely nothing there in the Elena/anyone else scenes, and this episode actually provided the perfect opportunity for one such moment. There was the very real possibility that Damon was dead or would be killed from Stefan and Elena's point of view twice, and Elena barely reacted at all. The worry, fear, deeper feeling was *all* on Stefan's part, which is fine if Elena isn't supposed to care about Damon, or have any under-the-surface feelings that she's denying, but I'm pretty sure she *is* supposed to care, and is supposed to have those feelings.

Or maybe she's not. Hmm, that brings me to a niggling pondering. I'm 90% sure that Damon is on the list of people that Elena has under her protection, but I'm not totally sure for two reasons. 1) We had Elijah very specifically mention that Alaric was on that list, and then 2) we had Elijah very specifically mention that the ONLY reason he was keeping Damon alive was because he believes that he'll do all he can to protect Elena, ie., no mention of him being on Elena's list. That possibility, coupled with her less than a passing interest in Damon's possible death, plus the fact that Damon called her on her similarity to Katherine way back in "Bad Moon Rising," paired with the (I'm wondering now) perhaps intentional manipulation in "Daddy Issues," makes me wonder if we'll find out that Elena hasn't forgiven him for what he did to Jeremy after all, but is instead using his feelings for her to help keep everyone she does love alive.

It wouldn't be out of character for Elena -- she did easily lie and betray him last season circa "Children of the Damned" and she has more reason now -- and it would certainly throw us all for a loop. I'm not saying I'd like it, but it'd be in character, make sense, and explain why we're seeing so little breakdown in Stefan/Elena, which needs to happen before anything with Damon and Elena can happen. And also, so little reaction from Elena about Damon in any way in scenes *other* than with Damon alone. So, in fact, we may be no where near Damon/Elena happening this season. However, if this *is* happening, I am okay with it, if it plays out fair and square and we start to see actual movement towards the end of the season -- maybe Elena saeeing Damon coming this close to dying making her truly begin to forgive him -- or next season. I don't know, just a thought.

Anyhoo, back to the flashback ... the one scene that was interesting was the final one with Lexi and Damon. While we didn't really get anything beyond what was totally expected with Stefan, that information was something new. Even back then when Damon had avowed his hatred of Stefan, he was already showing that he wanted the best for Stefan under the circumstances, and I do think we were supposed to have the unspoken thought that Stefan had Lexi to turn things around for him, so Damon needs someone too, someone he's never had. And, hey, maybe that someone will actually be Alaric. Pairing the first time Ric has flat-out said that he's Damon's friend with that bit with Lexi makes me think that's possible. 'Twould be cool.

Speaking of, I did absolutely love that Alaric told Damon he was his friend soooooooooo much, but the following line made no sense. "Damon, I'm your friend, and you don't have any friends." Huh? If Alaric is his friend, how does he have no friends? LOL! Maybe it was supposed to be "you don't have any other friends?" I dunno. But, that line (even as off as it was, and just accepting that Alaric is saying that at least Damon has ONE friend) also gives credence to the whole Elena hasn't forgiven Damon, he's not on her list, blah, blah, blah. Hmmm..... Still, regardless, I loved the Damon/Alaric stuff. Especially one of the BEST SCENES EVER THIS SEASON! That non-verbal scene after Elijah and Andie left when Damon smacked Alaric, Ric pointed emphatically at the dagger, Damon gestured What?! silently and just as emphatically, Ric wrote the reason down and Damon threw the paper aside in disgust was AWESOME!! I loved it so much. Rewound it a couple of times, and cracked up each time. Garsh, I love these two together sooooo much!

Also, I'm assuming that everyone else thought Damon's non-verbal response to Alaric in the basement after Ric told him not to lie to him was his keeping-his-cool way of agreeing to not lie anymore, right? Cuz Ric's his BFF, yes? And Damon loves him and wants to make him happy, right? Yup, thought so. Ooh, and speaking of their love, while I was all "NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!" when Alaric gave Uncle/Daddy John his ring, I did like his "you're gonna need it after what you did to my boyfriend, nyeah, nyeah, nyeah!" attitude. Hee!

Okay, randoms ...

- Elena remains awesomely bad-ass. I love her, even when I have to deal with her and Stefan (blech!) She stabbed herself, and then stabbed Elijah. Oh, Elena, you are THE awesome!

- But, waaah! Elijah was stabbed twice! Double waaah!!! Elijah is out of commission. Thus dies my dreams of Elijah and Jenna. (But at least he can come back from it!) *Sigh* Oh, and, uhm, if the dagger has to stay in Elijah to keep him down for the count, how they gonna kill Klaus? Hmmm?

- Ooh, speaking of Elijah and romance, was I the only one who thought that Daniel Gillies and Dawn Olivieri had a surprising amount of spark in their brief scenes together? A shame nothing will ever come of that. That little twirl between them was all sparkly and chemical!

- I actually was thinking at the beginning of the final Jeremy/Bonnie scene that their story felt a bit shoe-horned into the episode, but then Jonas came into the room and it all tied together nicely. Good job, show. Oh, and, they're still cute ... as long as they aren't kissing, LOL!

- Totally shallow, but waaaaaaaaaaaaaaay too much eyeliner on Matt Davis in a bunch of scenes in this episode, especially the first one.

- It must be said: No Caroline! NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO! First episode this season and I am disappoint! :(

- Wow, so Andie isn't even a distraction to Damon, she's more like an ornament he's using. Yikes. But I continue to like the character; I do think it's an interesting twist on how we're seeing the compulsion work. There was an interview with the actress where she said that other than her first scene and the beginning part of the bathtub scene Andie's pretty much under perpetual compulsion. Creepy!

- Alaric doesn't have his ring anymore (sobs!), and Bonnie has lost her witchy powers. Can we add two more higher-ranking possibilities to the major death this season? DON'T KILL ALARIC, SHOW! DO NOT KILL, ALARIC! Ahem.

- So, yeah, Damon (and Elena) were totally right to not trust John. Yuppers.

- And that reminds me. Major timeline/continuity error. It's clearly the NEXT DAY after last week's episode because Stefan and Elena are still on their weekend getaway at the lakehouse. At the end of last week's episode, presumably Saturday evening, Katherine looks not that much worse for the wear, but THE NEXT DAY! when Damon goes to visit her she looks like that?!?!? Uhm, someone made a boo-boo in the continuity department.

Wait, that was "Daddy Issues," not "Crying Wolf," but still way too much dessication in that time-frame compared with the last time we've seen her not doing well. We saw her in "Katerina" and then quite a bit later in "Daddy Issues," and there wasn't that much decay, and a much shorter time-frame has passed between DI and this episode. So, yeah, still too much dessication, but not nearly as bad as I originally thought.

- Still, I did love seeing crafty, quick-thinking Katherine again. She totally played Damon so perfectly. And speaking of played perfectly, I loved, loved how Ian Somerhalder played that final scene with Katherine. You could totally see it written all over Damon's face when Katherine first showed her face: OHMYGOD! ELENA IS NAKED IN MY SHOWER!!! WHOAH! And then the realization set in: Oh, darn, it's Katherine. Cracked me up. And I can't wait to see how things play out with Katherine and Elena and the boys next week. Hee!

So, very good episode that I would have enjoyed more had (a) I not been feeling like crap and (b) had the flashbacks been more interesting. I do hope I'm completely wrong in my Elena-hasn't-forgiven-Damon supposition, but if I'm not, it would still be cool character and story-wise. Overall, another strong episode. Whee! I love my show!
 
 
 
x5valex5vale on February 18th, 2011 12:11 pm (UTC)
About Stefan and Damon as vampires and Stefan all judgy one thing bugged me: Stefan had Lexi to help him very soon, so he began to control himself almost imeediately after he was turn, while Damon (even because he was stubborn enough to think he could do it on his own) was alone. Yes it was his choice to be alone, but for all different reasons that maybe people could think of.
So what I got from those flashbacks is that Stefan really ahs to stop to be so judgy and Damon..well he was good, he did really wanted to be, he just wasn't strong enough..as Lexi said.

'm possibly the only Vampire Diaries fan who was NOT in love with Lexi that I was kinda disappointed? And every time the reminder came up that Damon killed Lexi, I couldn't help but think, and saved Sheriff Forbes' life?
I am with you.

Funny how Stefan and *Elena* forget that part of the scene that played out. I'm not saying that Damon didn't expect the possibility (he had the stake handy), but the fact of the matter is that if that was the case, Lexi played right into his hands. Had she not turned to attack Liz, but instead tried to get the hell outta dodge once she got away from the deputies, Damon wouldn't have had to stake her. But, eh, what's Liz's life to Lexi's, right?
Right here with you.

Oh, and once again, Elena barely bats an eye. And we even had dialogue that inferenced the fact that Stefan continues to tell Elena only bits and pieces despite promising to tell her everything. And it's completely glossed over as bad boyfriend behavior. Again.
Elena being so biased there got on my nerves.

Or maybe she's not. Hmm, that brings me to a niggling pondering. I'm 90% sure that Damon is on the list of people that Elena has under her protection, but I'm not totally sure for two reasons. 1) We had Elijah very specifically mention that Alaric was on that list, and then 2) we had Elijah very specifically mention that the ONLY reason he was keeping Damon alive was because he believes that he'll do all he can to protect Elena, ie., no mention of him being on Elena's list.
Elijah told Damon that he was saving his life just because it was part of the deal with Elena in the previous episodes, but i think that an Original can even think to change the deal if one person he has to protect becomes dangerous.

And, hey, maybe that someone will actually be Alaric. Pairing the first time Ric has flat-out said that he's Damon's friend with that bit with Lexi makes me think that's possible. 'Twould be cool.
This is what I hope, because i see their relationship growing.

Also, I'm assuming that everyone else thought Damon's non-verbal response to Alaric in the basement after Ric told him not to lie to him was his keeping-his-cool way of agreeing to not lie anymore, right? Cuz Ric's his BFF, yes? And Damon loves him and wants to make him happy, right?
YES YES YES BODY LANGUAGE was so clear!

I loved, loved how Ian Somerhalder played that final scene with Katherine. You could totally see it written all over Damon's face when Katherine first showed her face: OHMYGOD! ELENA IS NAKED IN MY SHOWER!!! WHOAH! And then the realization set in: Oh, darn, it's Katherine. Cracked me up. And I can't wait to see how things play out with Katherine and Elena and the boys next week. Hee!
ITA.

I do hope I'm completely wrong in my Elena-hasn't-forgiven-Damon supposition, but if I'm not, it would still be cool character and story-wise. Overall, another strong episode. Whee! I love my show!
I think she did, but she hasn't realized yet why.

YEP I LOVE IT TOO!


Edited at 2011-02-18 12:12 pm (UTC)
Arabian: Damon04arabian on February 19th, 2011 02:38 am (UTC)
Elijah told Damon that he was saving his life just because it was part of the deal with Elena in the previous episodes

Nope, he didn't. I went back and watched the only ep it could have been in (the last one, which is the only episode since Elena made the deal that Elijah appeared in before this one). DAMON said that Elijah couldn't kill him because of the deal and Elijah responded "as soon as you you're no use to me...." So, it's still very possible that Damon's not included. Hmm....

As for Stefan and Damon, I see your point but it didn't work for me in the flashbacks because I'd already come to that conclusion WAAAY before this, and I know that others have too.

Overall, we definitely agree on most of the episode, though! :)
(no subject) - x5vale on February 19th, 2011 10:17 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - arabian on February 20th, 2011 05:32 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - x5vale on February 22nd, 2011 08:55 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - arabian on February 22nd, 2011 09:25 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - x5vale on February 23rd, 2011 10:07 am (UTC) (Expand)
waltzmatildah: tvd: katherine colouredwaltzmatildah on February 18th, 2011 12:33 pm (UTC)
This is a most insightful recap!

And you're definitely not alone re. the flashbacks. I was not feeling them AT ALL (aside from the Lexi/Damon moment towards the end). So much dead 'space' where we really learned nothing... Makes me think they really could have made room for some Caroline and/or Matt discovering that Tyler has left town...

I think Elijah's double death was huge if only for the fact that it shows he's not infallible when it comes to underestimating people which we know is a HUGE mistake. I mean, in the space of approximately one evening he managed to get himself 'tricked' into being killed... twice. All while he didn't actually manage to inflict damage on anyone. I know Elena ended up with self inflicted wounds, but she clearly knew she was going to have to do that from the first moment he showed up. She did not underestimate Elijah and that is why she is still alive.

Desperate people have weaknesses. Elijah was the ultimate desperate person. And not at all as BAMF as he has been. In fact, I'm pretty sure I slide Katherine back up into her (rightful) first spot as far as that title is concerned! (Though, Elena is also up there... It's only her martyrdom that makes her not quite as BAMF for me... She's still a little too selfless for BAMF status...).

Katherine, girl, you are too freaking awesome for your own good.

Your theories re. Elena and who is on her "Endangered Species" list is interesting. And if you're right I would also be interested to see how it plays out. Especially if (as you mention) Damon needs to come close to death for her to realise that maybe she can/does care for him (forgiveness or not, aside). And even more especially if the reason for his near demise is because he's risked himself to save her... (something that she was not prepared to do perhaps...).

Anyway, besides the lack of Cazza and the wishy washy flashbacks, very excellent episode...!
Arabian: Katherine01arabian on February 20th, 2011 05:44 pm (UTC)
you're definitely not alone re. the flashbacks.

Good to know; there were quite a few people who replied to me here agreeing. I so don't like being along among my flist who share my TVD thoughts generally, because then I wonder if I totally missed something, LOL!

So much dead 'space' where we really learned nothing... Makes me think they really could have made room for some Caroline and/or Matt discovering that Tyler has left town...

Yes, this so much. "Dead space" fits perfectly. And there really was no excuse for no Caroline. Had there been stuff that we couldn't see cut, I would be more understanding, but those flashback scenes (other than the Damon/Lexi scene, true dat) were not worthy of denying me my beloved Caroline. :sniffs:

Dude, your whole point about Elijah underestimating, and Elena not is such an awesome one, because, yup, that's exactly what happened.

Katherine, girl, you are too freaking awesome for your own good.

It was fabulous seeing KATHERINE back, because the last time we saw her beyond one dinky scene (with John in DI), she was a lot more Elena-like than we've ever seen her ("In the Light of the Moon"), so seeing Katherine being Katherine-y again was great!

Re: My theory, I wrote up a whole post about it, and I can still totally see it happening, but people have made some good points that make me think I'm totally wrong. The thing is that from a storytelling point of view, I really am okay either way because it will be in character for Elena either way as long as the writing continues as it's been.

besides the lack of Cazza and the wishy washy flashbacks, very excellent episode...!

Is Cazza Caroline? :Is confused: If so, then yes, I completely agree. :)
(no subject) - waltzmatildah on February 21st, 2011 01:07 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - arabian on February 22nd, 2011 09:27 pm (UTC) (Expand)
Diana: Vampire Diaries - Brothersbutterfly on February 18th, 2011 12:40 pm (UTC)
I liked Lexi in "162 Candles" but was kinda disappointed in her here. The bits with Lexi moralizing to Stefan were the weakest parts of the episode. Also, it makes it harder for me to feel bad about Damon killing her (150 years later) when she had the chance to form a bond with both brothers and clearly only cared about helping Stefan (something that was still true 150 years later). Everything that's happening with Damon on this show is disproving Emily and Lexi both treating Stefan like he's the special 'good' snowflake of the family - once Damon starts to get some real encouragement to learn to be better, he's actually been moving pretty quickly in that direction.

I have... different thoughts on you on why the Damon-Elena stuff tends to be isolated from the rest of the show this season, but I want to mull them over for a bit (but I did see a worry from her - when Stefan mentions that Damon is going to kill Elijah, she immediately goes - 'but, wait, oh, bad, there's this thing in the book'. And then, I think, a lot of her worry gets subsumed under her anger - she's pissed at Damon for planning to kill Elijah without informing her of his plans - and thus putting himself in danger).

I do think that Elena will take what Damon's doing with Andie a lot less in stride than Alaric did (oh, Alaric. Ha).

Hope you feel better.
Arabian: Damon&Stefan02arabian on February 20th, 2011 05:56 pm (UTC)
That's a really interesting point, re: Lexi that I never really thought about because I simply never cared for Lexi in "162 Candles," so I never expected to like her in this one, LOL! But, it's true, she started out by being Damon's all chopped liver, so why should he give a flying fig newton about her down the road?

Everything that's happening with Damon on this show is disproving Emily and Lexi both treating Stefan like he's the special 'good' snowflake of the family - once Damon starts to get some real encouragement to learn to be better, he's actually been moving pretty quickly in that direction.

Yup, yup, yup. And, hee, Stefan as "special snowflake." I will say though that I DO think that Emily thought that way about BOTH Stefan and Damon because when Stefan talked to Damon he mentioned to Damon that Emily didn't want *them* to know about Katherine because she wanted them to make the right decision (which, incidentally, Damon did, and Stefan did not, LOL!). Of course, that could have been Stefan not letting Damon know that yet another person didn't give a shit about him.

I have... different thoughts on you on why the Damon-Elena stuff tends to be isolated from the rest of the show this season

I am curious to read that post when it's posted. :nods:

I did see a worry from her

I know there was some worry there, which is why I said that it was "less than expected," because there was something there, I just thought that even with her anger, there should have been more since he very well could have died, as in gone forever, and not just be undead.

I do think that Elena will take what Damon's doing with Andie a lot less in stride than Alaric did

Oh, I totally expect that. I know that Julie Plec said there's a scene where Elena confronts him about it, but I'm still hoping that it's Alaric and/or Caroline (most likely Ric) that gets through to him that dude, it's so wrong what he's doing!

I am feeling much better. A good two night's worth of sleep helped considerably!

Edited at 2011-02-20 05:58 pm (UTC)
(no subject) - butterfly on February 22nd, 2011 04:04 pm (UTC) (Expand)
eolivet on February 18th, 2011 01:41 pm (UTC)
I'm possibly the only Vampire Diaries fan who was NOT in love with Lexi that I was kinda disappointed

Similar to what butterfly said, I enjoyed her in "162 Candles," but she also did nothing for me here. It was bizarre -- they used more time on Stefan's Reign of Terror and Bloodshed than they did on Stefan's Enlightenment. It's like Lexi used the Force or something, because if all it took was her inspirational sayings to change Stefan's ways ("People are people, too! Remember your humanity! All feelings are intensified! The greatest of all these is love!") then Stefan's Reign of Terror and Bloodshed was the equivalent of a bad day or a temper tantrum. :/

I found it a little hilarious that the Stefan/Lexi scenes boiled down to this:

Stefan: RARR! Blood is awesome! I love blood!
Lexi: No! Peoplehumanityfeelingslove!
Stefan: Oh, OK...cool. I hate blood now. ;p

(I actually thought that couldn't have possibly been it, and that final Damon/Lexi scene, I kept wondering if Stefan had like...stolen Damon's story, like it was Damon that had done all those things? IDK, I kept looking for a twist or a reveal and it...never came? Other than Damon was a good guy for the span of a day. Eh...)

As for Elena, I don't think she has any strong (positive) conscious feelings towards Damon -- I feel like it's more latent. I can't believe that she's intentionally manipulating him or consciously hasn't forgiven him -- more like...she does these things without thinking, and she doesn't even know why. It's odd to say there's no thought when it comes to how she feels about Damon, but I think that's sort of what it is. It's all subconscious at this point, and easily, consciously rationalized away -- to the point where if D/E does happen, IMO, it won't be gradual -- it'll be instantaneous -- like something snapping into place. Because those feelings are far too buried.

I really liked this ep -- much better than the last one, but not as much as "Daddy Issues" -- because there were many classic OMGWTF moments that were the hallmark of TVD S1 (Elijah being killed not once, but twice...the Katherine reveal [which shocked me, and I saw promo photos for next ep! This show! :p ]) Plus...at least 45% less Stefan/Elena, which is always a bonus. ;)
Diana: Vampire Diaries - Dancebutterfly on February 18th, 2011 04:10 pm (UTC)
I can't believe that she's intentionally manipulating him or consciously hasn't forgiven him -- more like...she does these things without thinking, and she doesn't even know why. It's odd to say there's no thought when it comes to how she feels about Damon, but I think that's sort of what it is. It's all subconscious at this point, and easily, consciously rationalized away -- to the point where if D/E does happen, IMO, it won't be gradual -- it'll be instantaneous -- like something snapping into place. Because those feelings are far too buried.

Yes. One of the things that struck me, immediately post-"The Return" is that Elena still instinctively trusts Damon. She hates him; she's pissed as hell at him, but she trusts him with herself.
(no subject) - arabian on February 20th, 2011 06:15 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - arabian on February 20th, 2011 06:07 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - eolivet on February 20th, 2011 06:19 pm (UTC) (Expand)
Sar: damon is a vampire!paceisthetrick on February 18th, 2011 02:36 pm (UTC)
I agree with everything you said. Honestly, I expected the flashbacks to be more on the gore side. They fell so flat. ;(

"And it's completely glossed over as if it's not REALLY bad boyfriend behavior. Again." I'm sick of Elena holding Stefan to some golden pedestal. It's really gotten to an extreme level at this point.

"to see how Damon went from that guy to who we saw in the Pilot." THIS soooooo much.

I'm honestly nervous about how Damon will cope with Kat back. Their dynamic is so dysfunctional.

But yes, although Elijah was one of my favorite characters EVER, Elena was fucking fantastic when she killed him. I called it straight away that she WASN'T bluffing.
Arabian: Damon08arabian on February 20th, 2011 06:10 pm (UTC)
They fell so flat. ;(

Yup, they fell flat. Perfect description.

If they are going to keep showing up Stefan as a lousy boyfriend, they need to have Elena start acknowledging it. I'm getting tired of them being presented as this perfect couple without any issues, when they DO have issues, they are just completely glossed over. Grrrr.

ut yes, although Elijah was one of my favorite characters EVER, Elena was fucking fantastic when she killed him. I called it straight away that she WASN'T bluffing.

This. So much this.
ancholiaancholia on February 18th, 2011 04:55 pm (UTC)
Hi! I discovered your LJ from the nian journal.
I have to say I love your reviews and after lurking a couple times, I thought I should comment.

So, on the show, I mostly agree with you. I, too, was really shocked to see the lack of reaction from Elena when she and Stefan realized Damon could died. It definitely make me wonder about Elena and if she really cares about Damon.
In one hand, she helped him with Rose and came back after to make sure Damon was ok and there's also that scene in the beginning of episode 2x10 where she include Damon in the people she cares about. In the other hand, she was clearly manipulating him in that bathroom scene in 1x13.
I like your theory about Damon being near death for Elena realizing her feelings. I have this pesky idea about a fic, post s2 finale: Damon decides to leave Mystic Falls, the Klaus problem fixed, because he can't keep watching Elena and Stefan together and Elena misses him and realizes she might love him.

Anyway, I really liked the last scene because as you said, Ian Somerhalder played it so well. I just want to be next week to see the interactions between the four of them. It should be interesting, to say the least.
Arabian: Damon & Elena(PR)01arabian on February 20th, 2011 06:11 pm (UTC)
Aww, thanks for coming out of lurking. :)

So, on the show, I mostly agree with you. I, too, was really shocked to see the lack of reaction from Elena when she and Stefan realized Damon could died. It definitely make me wonder about Elena and if she really cares about Damon.

Well, I don't doubt that Elena does care about Damon, I just think that she's so submerged her feelings for him that on the surface she's let her anger and frustration with him take control.

Ooh, I can't wait for next week too. SO EXCITED!!!
lacrimadraconis: TVD Damon Elena starelacrimadraconis on February 18th, 2011 08:26 pm (UTC)
Nah, I was a little disappointed with the flashback as well. I do like Lexi and am still miffed about Damon killing her, but actually that what rather about what he did to Stefan there than about Lexi herself.

I don't think that Elena is playing Damon. She is not the best liar when it comes to people who are emotionally close to her. And I think she would be, even if she was close to him in terms of hate rather than anything else, still emotionally attached to him. She always reacts emotionally towards him, be it anger or care, so I just can't see her being coldly manipulating to such a degree.
There was more to this that I wanted to say, but I need to re-watch some scenes before I get back to you. It is an interesting theory, but I don't think you have to worry.

I hope you'll get better soon :)
Arabian: Damon & Elena09arabian on February 20th, 2011 06:13 pm (UTC)
Nice to know I was not the only one disappointed in those flashbacks.

You know what discussion has been going on in the theory thread, I'm now more leaning towards being 60/40 whereas when I wrote my theory post, I was at 80/20, then 50/50, but the last few posts in that thread have knocked me more into thinking it's not going down that way.

I hope you'll get better soon :)

Thanks, a few nights of good rest have really helped. :)
(no subject) - waltzmatildah on February 21st, 2011 01:20 am (UTC) (Expand)
tams71tams71 on February 18th, 2011 11:06 pm (UTC)
Sorry you're not feeling so hot. Sending get well vibes your way :)

You are definitely not alone in your feelings regarding the Stefan flashbacks. I was expecting to see vengeful, demon-like Stefan terrorizing the inhabitants of Mystic Falls in an all out bloodiest, but instead we got a young, hungry, unrestrained vampire who with a snap of Lexie's fingers, broke free and was reformed within, what seemed, a matter of a day. Totally unbelievable to me. I was disappointed with the story they chose to portray.

Stefan's claim that he was "worse" than Damon in those days was a crock of ish. The Damon we all know and love was, when he first appeared on the scene, way more badass, terrifying, and monster-like than Stefan could ever be and Paul Wesley, while a good actor, just can't play dark, creepy and diabolical the way Ian can.

You made some good points in your insights into Elena's reactions regarding Damon's possible demise, the people who she references as "the people I love", and the inevitable triangle, but I think that Elena's reaction was more cemented in the fact that once again she was left out of the loop and that Stefan and Damon went behind her back to null and void her deal with Elijah. She was pissed hence her comment to both of them back at the boarding house that if they wanted her to fight she would. In my opinion, Elena is so deeply invested in keeping her friends and family safe that her feelings for Damon, which we all know she has, are buried by everything that is happening right NOW. I'm not sure we'll see Damon/Elena by the end of the season, but TPTB are not going to pass on the TRUE epic romance of the show, Damon and Elena. It will come.

Lexie - You are not the only TVD fan who didn't really like her. I thought she was judgmental and too bitchy. Her scene with Damon in that last flashback showed her obvious dislike for Damon and she didn't even know him or what Stefan did to him. I did like the foreshadowing in that scene of Damon's hate getting the best of him, which it did. In a way I wish Lexie were still alive so she could see how Damon has come full circle, but I thought her death, by Damon's hand, was essential to the story. I believe Damon saving Liz's life that night helped to strengthen the bond between Damon and Liz, which is integral to the show.

Damon and Alaric - EPIC bromance! Loved each and every one of their moments in the episode. I heart them so. I loved that scene in the basement. Friends always tell you the truth, no matter if you want to hear it or not and Alaric calling Damon out was exactly what a true friend would do.

Alaric going all BAMF! Loved it!!!!! So much love for his badassery :)

Elijah being offed was a shock, but twice, even bigger shock. Alaric was bad ass in that first attempt, but Miss Elena was bad ass to the nth degree. When she straight up told Elijah what she would do, I knew she wasn't bluffing. Let it be known, Elena Gilbert isn't as fragile and "damsel in distress-like as everyone thinks. Girl has got some major cajones!!

Andie is totally an ornament to Damon which sucks and is totally creepy, but we have to remember, she is Damon's "beard" and under compulsion or not, she knew she would be used as a temporary whatever. As for Dawn's chemistry with Daniel Gilles...Hell to the Yeah! There was something cooking there and I bet that twirl was improvised.

Jonas - Whoa! I didn't know that witches or warlocks could take away another's powers. I found it quite interesting that he took them away for her own good, rather than to punish her. Hmmm.

OMG that last scene with Damon walking in to find Katherine in his shower...BAM! So funny that when he heard the shower running he immediately thought it was Andie, then when he caught a glimpse he thought he was Elena and then surprise, surprise finding out it was Katherine...Double BAM! I can just imagine what kind of house guest she'll be.

Good episode. I wasn't blown away (except for Elijah being offed and Elena turning into Lara Croft Tomb Raider), but all in all, pretty cool.
sarahlynnlsarahlynnl on February 19th, 2011 02:44 am (UTC)
Thank God! I disliked Lexi in 163 candles and liked her even less in the flashbacks. I thought I was the only one who disliked her. Plus hate the fact that everyone forgets that she was going to kill the sheriff if Damon hadn't have staked her. Stefan would have let her do it too even though that is the mother of Elena's best friend.
(no subject) - arabian on February 20th, 2011 06:30 pm (UTC) (Expand)
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crowandfogcrowandfog on February 19th, 2011 02:58 am (UTC)
So I clicked on the lj-cut ready to comment with a "short post is short but sweet," lol, but I should have known better. Your long thoughts are, after all, part of the reason why I adore you. :D I hope you start feeling better soon!

Re: the flashbacks were a waste of time. I agree with you. I am glad that Stefan's Damon-surpassing level of evil is canon, but, otherwise, I'm not really sure what the writers were going for there. I don't think I had the reaction that I was supposed to have to the flashbacks. I did not feel more sympathetic towards or understanding of Stefan, and I actually like Lexi a lot less after this episode. I feel like she unjustifiably played favorites just like every other person in the Salvatores' lives during that time. And I wrote on midnightblack07's wall that I think it might be just another reason why Damon killed her. Like, why was she determined to stick with Stefan and be his friend, but she just let Damon go after a two-second lecture? Did she have some kind of radar that let her see Stefan was "pure of heart" and thus worth helping? Also, I lost some respect for Stefan, because he told Damon that doing the right thing only means something when you're doing it simply because it's the right thing, but now we see that the "rightest" thing Stefan has ever done, he did because of someone else. Lexi didn't just inspire Stefan to change; she hung around and pretty much forced it to happen. So, this episode really fueled my "STFU, Stefan" flames. I don't think that's what the writers were hoping for....

Before this episode, I assumed that past!Damon became like present!Damon immediately after turning, so, now, like you, I'm really interested in seeing just when Damon started to turn off his humanity. Maybe it happened over time? I mean, I guess that's why they had Lexi say that stuff about "your hatred will consume you, you think you can control it but you can't" or whatever. Still, I want to see it.

When Elena said that that Stefan sounded like Damon, and Stefan said he was worse, I couldn't agree based on what we were seeing.

I think Stefan came across as worse because, when Damon was partying with those sorority girls, he had no intentions of killing them. He wasn't making them watch their friends die, and he wasn't making them get excited about it. "Who wants to die next?" I thought that was really gross. And Damon doesn't leave bodies lying around the living room. "Oops, I meant to dispose of those." So imo that made Stefan worse. But I had been hoping that Stefan would actually be even more horrible than what we got, and, if he was only like that for a few weeks, I think it's ridiculous.
crowandfogcrowandfog on February 19th, 2011 03:05 am (UTC)
Two weeks in a row of me typing too much. This time, I went back and took out long quotes, but my comment was STILL several hundred characters too long! How does that happen??? LOL. Let me know if you need me to shut up more. Goodness! Anyway...

Re: Damon not being on Elena's list. I think my head just exploded. HOLY THEORY!!!!! But I could totally see that happening. I don't want to see that, but I could. And ASDOJHSDGFLKJASDGFHHIDKKHGHLKD if that's the truth. Like, I would need Damon to kill someone for that. I would need him to kill someone IMPORTANT. And whoever it was, I wouldn't even miss them, because SOMEONE NEEDED TO DIE. But, I need to calm down, because that's not likely. Right? But Elijah is so careful with his words... And OMG!!!!! What have you done to me???? In 2x14, (yes, I DID go check to make sure) when Damon says, "You can't kill me, man. It's not part of the deal." Elijah says, "Silence" and stabs him! Then he says, "...the moment you cease to be of use to me, you're dead." OMG OMG OMG OMG!!!!! The problem is that on a show like this, they are always looking for the most shocking twist imaginable, and these writers are like on crack with the insanity. And that's why, when you're theory would be totally weightless with some other show, it holds water with TVD. I am feeling so many emotions right now. So many emotions. I mean, that would be glorious, but also very, very upsetting.

Ooh, and speaking of their love, while I was all "NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!" when Alaric gave Uncle/Daddy John his ring, I did like his "you're gonna need it after what you did to my boyfriend, nyeah, nyeah, nyeah!" attitude. Hee!

I was like NOOOOO, too, but then Alaric just got so awesome with his smirk over John's impending doom. Alaric and Damon are fast becoming one of my favorite TV friendships ever. AND IF THE KILL ALARIC I AM WRITING SOME NASTY LETTERS TO EVERYONE I CAN GET AN ADDRESS FOR!!!!!!

And speaking of played perfectly, I loved, loved how Ian Somerhalder played that final scene with Katherine. You could totally see it written all over Damon's face when Katherine first showed her face: OHMYGOD! ELENA IS NAKED IN MY SHOWER!!! WHOAH! And then the realization set in: Oh, darn, it's Katherine. Cracked me up.

LOVED IT!!!!!!!! Every time I see a gif from that moment, I giggle so hard.
(no subject) - arabian on February 19th, 2011 03:51 am (UTC) (Expand)
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Myramidnightblack07 on February 19th, 2011 05:59 am (UTC)
I wasn't all that fazed/impressed by the flashbacks either to be completely honest; they were just sort of "there" for me, almost everything else in the episode stood out for me so much more than they did which is a bit of a let down considering how much hype surrounded them...

that said, I did like the implications attatched to the brothers' relationship (Stefan's desperation to keep his brother at all costs, Damon appearing as if he was "done" with Stefan but then telling Lexi to help him, etc); as well as the allusions to how Lexi played a role not only in Stefan's life but in their relationship as well because there are sooo many potential interpretations regarding Damon's subconsious reasons for killing Lexi and I didn't even consider any of them before reading the opinions of other people on my flist (he could have harbored some resentment towards her for the role she played in Stefan's life and how he turned out and/or for not offering him the same hand of friendship she offered Stefan, etc).

I share your need to see more Damon-centric flashbacks, in fact the only ones we've seen from his perspective were some (not even all) of the ones from "Children of the Damned." It'd be interesting to see how he transitioned from that softer, more careful newborn to the man/vamp we see today...

But at least he can come back from it!

OMG I AM BANKING SO HARD ON THIS YOU HAVE NO IDEA!! But really, that whole "the dagger needs to stay in his chest" bit is faaar too suseptible to foul play for it not to be something they'd use in the future me thinks (or hopes lol).

You could totally see it written all over Damon's face when Katherine first showed her face: OHMYGOD! ELENA IS NAKED IN MY SHOWER!!! WHOAH! And then the realization set in: Oh, darn, it's Katherine.

HA!! that is exactly how I interpreted it because, I mean, I doubt the first thing that would have come to mind would have been "heeey it's Katherine and she got out of the tomb and she's totally helping herself to my awesome shower" hehe =P
waltzmatildah: tvd: ian somerhalder is hotwaltzmatildah on February 21st, 2011 01:41 am (UTC)
OHMYGOD! ELENA IS NAKED IN MY SHOWER!!! WHOAH! See, I didn't think that at all...

I don't think even Damon is utterly clueless enough to believe that out of all the bathrooms that surely exist in that house Elena would choose HIS to use. Personally, I thought he thought it was Andie (and that maybe we're gonna find that he's quite enjoying her company?) and then realised that it was Katherine... At which point? PRICELESS FACIAL EXPRESSION MORPH!!!

I think Damon thinking "Heeeeey, it's Elena and she's completely forgotten that she's Stefan's girlfriend and that she doesn't particularly like me all that much and is totally helping herself to my awesome shower" is any more realistic than the Katherine version that you mentioned!!

I think, "Ooh, Andie's here... Sexy tiems abound... OH FUCK IT'S KATHERINE..." is the most likely...

(though, this might be because, mostly, I really, REALLY hope Damon is not clueless/deluded enough to think it could be Elena.)
(no subject) - arabian on February 21st, 2011 02:49 am (UTC) (Expand)
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Heather-Annlinsell_farm on February 19th, 2011 09:53 pm (UTC)
I hope you start feeling better soon, Jen. *hugs*

I did enjoy the flashbacks, even if they were mostly Stefan-centric. Part of that is because the information given just made me feel more for Damon. Plus, being a Lexi fan, I adored her in period garb. I loved her very prophetic "The hate you are feeling will control you."

Damon needs someone too, someone he's never had. And, hey, maybe that someone will actually be Alaric.

Very interesting. I like the way you think. :o)

Elena remains awesomely bad-ass. I love her, even when I have to deal with her and Stefan (blech!) She stabbed herself, and then stabbed Elijah. Oh, Elena, you are THE awesome!

So Much This ^

That little twirl between them was all sparkly and chemical!

Definitely agree. Elijah was flirting with every single person at that dinner party. I will most certainly miss him.

Andie's pretty much under perpetual compulsion. Creepy!

and Disturbing :(

DON'T KILL ALARIC, SHOW! DO NOT KILL, ALARIC! Ahem.

THIS

in that time-frame

I've noticed that the timeline between episodes seems condensed this season. Several episodes are the next day, like The Return to Brave New World, Masquerade to Rose, Daddy Issues to The Dinner Party. Plan B was pretty close in time to Masquerade. There were several weeks between Plan B and By the Light of the Moon, though.

This got me thinking that it's only been maybe 6 weeks of show timeline since Damon snapped Jer's neck, and it would make sense that Elena would not have forgiven him for it, yet.

Still, I did love seeing crafty, quick-thinking Katherine again. She totally played Damon so perfectly. And speaking of played perfectly, I loved, loved how Ian Somerhalder played that final scene with Katherine. You could totally see it written all over Damon's face when Katherine first showed her face: OHMYGOD! ELENA IS NAKED IN MY SHOWER!!! WHOAH! And then the realization set in: Oh, darn, it's Katherine. Cracked me up. And I can't wait to see how things play out with Katherine and Elena and the boys next week. Hee!

I'm totally with you on this!!!

I'm glad to be back in the land of "OMG I LOVE MY SHOW" :o)
Arabian: Ian & Nina(PS)03arabian on February 22nd, 2011 09:18 pm (UTC)
I did enjoy the flashbacks, even if they were mostly Stefan-centric. Part of that is because the information given just made me feel more for Damon. Plus, being a Lexi fan, I adored her in period garb. I loved her very prophetic "The hate you are feeling will control you."

I don't mind Stefan-centric flashbacks. I'd just like it to be more even, and right now, it's so completely not. I just did a tally in response to someone else's comment and it's so beyond NOT even --

1.06 - "Lost Girls" ... Stefan-centric, no Damon-based ones.
1.13 - "Children of the Damned" ... Mostly Damon-centric, but with important Stefan-centric flashbacks
1.20 - "Blood Brothers" ... Stefan-centric, with one Damon-centric flashback that was about Stefan
2.04 - "Memory Lane" ... Stefan-centric, with very few glimpses of Damon
2.15 - "The Dinner Party" ... Stefan-centric, with one teeny Damon flashback

A-NNOY-ING! Big time. I want me some Damon-centric flashbacks and a whole buttload of them to balance it out, show!

"Andie's pretty much under perpetual compulsion. Creepy!"

and Disturbing :(


Yes. I really can't wait for this character/"relationship" to go bye-bye. I mean, I think that butterfly had a great point in that Damon is compelling this all (including telling her to fall for him) because the realness of his feelings for Elena is so painful that he wants every moment with Andie to be fake, but it's incredibly creepy.

This got me thinking that it's only been maybe 6 weeks of show timeline since Damon snapped Jer's neck, and it would make sense that Elena would not have forgiven him for it, yet.

Yup.

Edited at 2011-02-22 09:18 pm (UTC)
Jude: tvd; elena throws pillow at damondanceonstardust on February 20th, 2011 06:59 am (UTC)
I actually ignored the beginning of the episode with the flashbacks because my mom and I were babysitting my brother's kids. Then I went back, DIDN'T CARE AT ALL. lol.

Speaking of, I did absolutely love that Alaric told Damon he was his friend soooooooooo much
LITERALLY SQUEED OUT LOUD.

Ooh, and speaking of their love, while I was all "NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!" when Alaric gave Uncle/Daddy John his ring, I did like his "you're gonna need it after what you did to my boyfriend, nyeah, nyeah, nyeah!" attitude. Hee!
Same here, I was like "Ric, you outta your mind." I tend to yell at the screen like Jada Pinkett Smith does in Scream 2 when this show comes on. lol. I can't help it. Then I went "oooh, you got told." when he told him that. haha.

Elena remains awesomely bad-ass. I love her, even when I have to deal with her and Stefan (blech!) She stabbed herself, and then stabbed Elijah. Oh, Elena, you are THE awesome!
Blech on Stefan and her but YES to the awesomeness. Owww btw. xD

But, waaah! Elijah was stabbed twice! Double waaah!!! Elijah is out of commission. Thus dies my dreams of Elijah and Jenna. (But at least he can come back from it!) *Sigh* Oh, and, uhm, if the dagger has to stay in Elijah to keep him down for the count, how they gonna kill Klaus? Hmmm?
T_T Not my favorite moment. I love him, IDC what some fans say because he stabbed Damon, people hurt the man all the time! Elijah is still kickass. YES I THOUGHT I WAS THE ONLY ONE THAT SHIPPED THEM BOTH. Damn it, we again are mind twins. xD

It must be said: No Caroline! NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO! First episode this season and I am disappoint! :(
*pouts*

DON'T KILL ALARIC, SHOW! DO NOT KILL, ALARIC! Ahem.
IF THEY DO. GAH I would totally cry. D:

Still, I did love seeing crafty, quick-thinking Katherine again. She totally played Damon so perfectly. And speaking of played perfectly, I loved, loved how Ian Somerhalder played that final scene with Katherine. You could totally see it written all over Damon's face when Katherine first showed her face: OHMYGOD! ELENA IS NAKED IN MY SHOWER!!! WHOAH! And then the realization set in: Oh, darn, it's Katherine. Cracked me up. And I can't wait to see how things play out with Katherine and Elena and the boys next week. Hee!

My mom and I were like going "OMG, OMG OMG." for a few seconds until we realize it was Katherine. Well, I realized it at first, my mom was going all "Wait, Elena is in the shower... she going to...?" Then I told her it was Katherine. The disappointment on my mom's face was priceless. DAMON'S FACE WAS PRICELESS. I LITERALLY LAUGHED OUT LOUD. I kept watching it over and over. He literally was shocked and a bit turned on. I love you Ian. xD Can I tell you, the music is perfect for Katherine in that scene? Just, gah. Same here. In fact, I'm impatient. I loved, LOVED the scene in the trailer, where I think Damon basically attacks Elena thinking it's Katherine. I mean the abuse sucks but they are really close and it's really hot. xD

Edited at 2011-02-20 07:01 am (UTC)
Arabian: Damon & Elena01arabian on February 22nd, 2011 09:23 pm (UTC)
I actually ignored the beginning of the episode with the flashbacks because my mom and I were babysitting my brother's kids. Then I went back, DIDN'T CARE AT ALL. lol.

LOL! Actually, the first (and last with Damon, natch!) was the most interesting one, though. Still, yeah, added up to a big fat pile of what's the point?

I was like "Ric, you outta your mind." I tend to yell at the screen like Jada Pinkett Smith does in Scream 2 when this show comes on. lol. I can't help it. Then I went "oooh, you got told." when he told him that. haha.

Alaric telling John that Damon would get him done good just warmed my heart.

I love him (Elijah), IDC what some fans say because he stabbed Damon, people hurt the man all the time! Elijah is still kickass. YES I THOUGHT I WAS THE ONLY ONE THAT SHIPPED THEM BOTH. Damn it, we again are mind twins. xD

Pfft! It's not Damon didn't deserved to be penciled by Elijah (and I say this even being a ridiculous Damon-stan). Ah, alas, I think Jenna/Elijah will never happen now. :( But, yay! Mind-twins! :D

My mom and I were like going "OMG, OMG OMG." for a few seconds until we realize it was Katherine. Well, I realized it at first, my mom was going all "Wait, Elena is in the shower... she going to...?" Then I told her it was Katherine. The disappointment on my mom's face was priceless. DAMON'S FACE WAS PRICELESS. I LITERALLY LAUGHED OUT LOUD. I kept watching it over and over. He literally was shocked and a bit turned on. I love you Ian. xD Can I tell you, the music is perfect for Katherine in that scene? Just, gah. Same here. In fact, I'm impatient. I loved, LOVED the scene in the trailer, where I think Damon basically attacks Elena thinking it's Katherine. I mean the abuse sucks but they are really close and it's really hot. xD

Hah, your mom cracks me up. So much this. I still don't see how anyone watching that didn't think Damon thought it was Elena at first, but I know that some did. To me, not thinking he saw it as Elena first takes away some of Ian's awesome acting in that moment.